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Thank you for sharing your experience, Vilas.
This seems to be one way to do Kāyānupassanā. To look at and contemplate on how the physical body functions, “frame-by-frame.”
This is relevant to what I tried to explain with the post, “Vision Is a Series of “Snapshots” – Movie Analogy.”
sumbodhi wrote: “At one point I thought it would be impossible for a “simple human” to discover such deep reality, but then I reminded to myself he’s worked on it for tens of millions of jātī. So it is possible, it just takes a lot of dedication.”
Yes. A Buddha is a very special person. It is hard to explain how “special” a Buddha is. The appearance of a Buddha is very rare too. We are lucky to be human during a time when access to Buddha Dhamma is possible.
I discussed this a little bit in the post “Pāramitā and Niyata Vivarana – Myths or Realities?”P.S. There seems to be a problem at the forum main page. It is not updating to show new comments. I am trying to fix the problem.
– If anyone has a problem with publishing a post, please send me an email: [email protected]sumbodhi wrote: “Saññā seems to be helpful. Does the Canon mention about such communication and why it happens. What reason would they have to do so? To help someone??
You seem to be referring to communications that happen without “talking”, but with saññā.
– There are many living beings who do not have physical bodies ours. So, there are no mouths, tongues, etc for talking.
– Those beings include some lower beings in peta realms as well as Brahmas in Brahma realms. For example, when Sahampti Brahma communicated with the Buddha right after his Enlightenment, that is how they communicated.
– Such communications are not common, especially with Brahmas. But some lower beings seem to communicate with people with “bad gati” and get them to do immoral things. Also, there could be devas in lower realms trying to help people with good gati. I personally have had no such experiences.
– Did you read about it in a post? I do not remember the name of such a post. If you know what it is, please post the name (with a link if you know how to). That will help others.
– One post with some relevance is, “What Does Buddha Dhamma Say about Creator, Satan, Angels, and Demons?”sumbhodi asked: “why would gandhabbā communicate with humans?”
I am not aware of specific cases of human gandhabbas communicating with humans.
My apologies, Siebe.
I somehow did not see your post until now.
Yes. Those are three important suttas. Unless we “get stuck” on an arammana and “start thinking and doing things” (generating vaci and kaya sankhara), that vinnana WILL not grow.
– Then one would not accumulate vaci kamma or kaya kamma.I will be discussing more on this in the next couple of posts. Thanks for pointing out the suttas.
P.S. There seems to be a problem at the forum main page. It is not updating to show new comments. I am trying to fix the problem.
– If anyone has a problem with publishing a post, please send me an email: [email protected]sumbodhi wrote: “My opinion is that even tho QM has probably made the most precise measurements (and predictions) ever done in science it’s not enough to give the complete picture. To draw in Buddhism it seems that QM might be governing reality only up to and including suddhātthaka levels.”
You are correct.
What happens below the suddhātthaka level is all MENTAL.
– QM or science, in general, has no idea of the power of the human mind.
– Suddhātthaka are created by the mind.At the suddhātthaka level, “everything and every living being” is inter-connected.
– This is called “quantum entanglement” in QM and you are likely to familiar with that. See, “Quantum Entanglement – We Are All Connected”This is a very broad subject. I have discussed it at: “Quantum Mechanics and Dhamma.”
You can get an idea about my thoughts in the post, “Quantum Mechanics and Dhamma – Introduction.”
I have discussed the “observer effect” in that section.
“Does jivitindriya belong to the gandhabba? But what/where is jivitindriya in the gandhabba? Is it part of citta or is it part of pasada rupa?”
This is explained in the post (especialy #8), “Gandhabba Sensing the World – With and Without a Physical Body.”
What I stated above is essentially correct.
In the analysis of rupa in the post, “Rupa (Material Form) – Table” everything is put into “fundamental categories.”
Everything in our physical body (except for the pasada rupa and hadaya vatthu) are made exclusively from the four great elements (maha bhuta): patavi, apo, tejo, vayo.
Five pasada rupa and hadaya vatthu are made of the smallest units of patavi, apo, tejo, vayo, vanna, sadda, gandha, and rasa PLUS the energies imparted by the kammic energy (Those are the only “live” things in the body). See, “The Origin of Matter – Suddhātthaka.”
– That is why the physical body becomes inert when the gandhabba leaves at the death of the physical body.
– As Tobias pointed out, it is the jivitindriya that gives “life” to body parts in a “live person.” There are few other elements like jivitindriya that also contribute (itthi/purisa, and oja). All those are in the manomaya kaya or the gandhabba and created at the beginning of the human bhava (cuti-patisandhi moment) by kammic energy. Those are also listed in that post on the analysis of rupa.That the pasada rupa are the “real” sensory elements (and not the physical eyes, ears, etc) is discussed in #12 of “Buddhist Worldview – Introduction.”
OK. I had a bit of time to think about it. Here are two things to think about:
1. The categorization of rupa in the post, “Rupa (Material Form) – Table” is at the fundamental level.
– On that level “internal rupa” are in a category by themselves. Those are the pasada rupa responsible for actual sensing.
– Our physical bodies are made of the four great elements (maha bhuta): patavi, apo, tejo, vayo. Those “elements” do not belong to “us”.2. However, a live person has control over his/her body IN CERTAIN aspects.
– For example, we can use our bodies to moral deeds or immoral deeds.
– Therefore, in Kāyānupassanā, for example, “Iti ajjhattaṃ vā kāye kāyānupassī viharati” refers to one’s physical body. That means stopping it for immoral deeds and to use it for moral deeds.So, it depends on the context.
– In the absolute categorization, internal rupa would be pasada rupa.
– But in the context of Kāyānupassanā, for example, ajjhatta kāya refers to ones’s own physical body.Good point. May be that is why I had it that way.
But we need to take time and review the case for both sides. If anyone has ideas, please post.
Tobias asked: “Is the physical body external rupa?”
The physical body, as well as pasada rūpa, are internal rupa.
– Pasada rūpa (cakkhu, sōta, ghāna, jivhā, and kāya) cannot function without physical eyes, ears, nose, tongue, and the physical body.I see your point. I need to revise the post. Thanks.
sumbodhi wrote: ” I think it’s still worthwhile to explore connections between the ‘newest’ science and Dhamma as it might be easier to explain to wider public using “modern” terminology.”
Yes. I do that whenever possible. New findings of science are compatible with Buddha Dhamma in many cases. The exception is “mental phenomena.” Science is clueless in saying that thoughts arise in an inert brain.
See, “Dhamma and Science”sumbodhi: “Of course such comparisons are only helpful as an introduction but still helpful to some. I have only been reading about Buddha Dhamma for 3 months now and at first your web-page seemed very technical, especially with so many Pāḷi words.”
Yes. I struggle with trying to find middle ground. You are on one end of the spectrum. At the other end are those ask for Tipitaka references and explanations.
In any case, one NEEDS to learn the meanings of the key Pali words, if one is truly interested in learning Buddha Dhamma. Some Pali words like anicca, anatta, sankhara, vinnana DO NOT have exact translations to English. The first sub-sections in the following section could be helpful:
“Living Dhamma.”Also, “Moral Living and Fundamentals“
“However you mention suddhātthaka aren’t electrically charged, which means suddhātthaka is another sort of particle possibly outside of the standard model.”
Yes. Science is still far away from “getting the whole picture”.
“By the way, where does the suddhātthaka scale come from? Is it explicitly mentioned in Tipitaka?”
Yes. It is not in the suttas. It is in Abhidhamma Piṭaka. I need to spend some time at some point in getting to those details.
– But discussing Paticca Samuppada has priority. That is what is done in the “Origin of Life” series.“We won’t be able to create a conscious robot because even if we created the body (or whatever bearer) consciousness must always come from gandhabba which we can never create (probably not?).”
Yes. We need to leave out, “probably not.” It can NEVER happen. Sentient life arises ONLY as a kamma vipaka.
Of course, the Paticca Samuppada step, “upadana paccaya bhava” MUST happen too.
– An Arahant may have kammic energies from kamma done in this life or past lives that COULD give rise to another existence (bhava).
– But an Arahant’s mind would NOT go through the “tanha paccaya upadana” step, and thus “upadana paccaya bhava” step.
– That what we will be discussing next in the “Origin of Life” series.Consciousness ARISE in the mental body (manomaya kaya or gandhabba for humans and animals.)
The gandhabba is the essential part, not the physical body.
– When one gets a human bhava, one gets a corresponding mental body (gandhabba). That can last many thousands of years.
“Bhava and Jāti – States of Existence and Births Therein”– Within that time gandhabba can be born with a physical human body many times. When one physical body dies, the gandhabba comes out of that dead body and waits for another suitable womb with a compatible zygote.
These concepts are explained in:“Buddhist Explanations of Conception, Abortion, and Contraception”
“Cloning and Gandhabba”The key point is that a gandhabba can NEVER be created in a laboratory. A sentient life ALWAYS comes from a pre-existing sentient life.
– Modern science (a laboratory) may be able to create a “zygote-like” entity (which is just the right “chemical composition”) for the gandhabba to start making a new physical body. In fact, cloning is a crude form of that.
– But a gandhabba only comes a previous existing life (in any of the 31 realms.)
– For example when a deva or a brahma dies and if the next birth is as human, then at that instant a “human gandhabba” is created by kammic energy.sumbodhi wrote: “altho sub-suddhātthakā levels seem more like ‘fields’ to me.”
That is correct. Even the suddhātthaka level is below the “atoms” in modern science.
– As I pointed out in the post, “Mystical Phenomena in Buddhism?,” some of the “mystical phenomena” can be explained by learning about such details.
– For example, our physical bodies (as well as walls) are mostly empty as explained there. One with iddhi powers can “reduce the body” to suddhātthaka level and then go through the “mostly empty walls.” I hope you can get the idea.So, that explanation does not involve QM (Quantum Mechanics).
– Teleporting (in Buddha Dhamma) is similar.Traveling to Brahma loka is normally done with just the mental body (manomaya kaya or gandhabba.) That manomaya kaya has only a few suddhātthaka.
Anyway, I mention these only to show that these phenomena are NOT “magical” once one understands the concepts.
– Modern science is far behind.
