Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Lal, can we say that work to be done after sottapana stage, is contemplating on dukkhā characteristics?
Countless infinite uncountable unfathomable number of great eons have passed so far …
Still no end to quest to pursue happiness in this world can be seen.
So many tears dropped.
So much blood spilled.
So many body of all sorts, aquired and dropped.So many times building sandcastles on beach.
Small and big.
Only for them to be taken away by waves in some timeStruggling to gain liked.
Struggling to keep liked as wished.
Mourning at the helplessness arising due to seperation from all that was hold dear.Struggling to keep away unliked.
Struggling to remove unliked.
Mourning against helplessness when despite all the efforts unliked still arises, when unliked can’t be removed.Where’s true security in this world?
Where is it?
What have we found that we have been able to keep?
What true profit is there in this world?
This life too shall pass away in vain, empty way, just like infinite lives before …
Buddha has gave up, Great arhants have gave up.
Gave up seeking happiness in this world.
Have we?
By last argument, I meant Last argument in my post. I should have wrote, “My last argument” Dosakkhayo.
Differentiation between two state of object is manifested due to causality.
Difference are experienced due to having senses in first place. Senses comes due to tanha. Experiencing objects with anicca nature is always suffering, hence, why objects with Aniccā nature are not worth attaching to.
How can there be two different elements in absence of causality?
Nibbanā is not subject to casuality.
Nibbanā is ONLY unconditional element. It is accessed through removal of root causes. Root causes are six. They are responsible for arising of suffering.
Alara kalama and other person had ignorance regarding causality.
They thought that existence there doesn’t end. But, it does.
Buddha even before he started his quest to enlightenment in his last life, said that he will find DEATHLESS element.
A *PERMANENT* escape from suffering. Not temporary fix. That is why he was not satisfied with jhana.
Last argument is that let’s assume hypothetically there is some element other than nibbanā which is higher than nibbanā.
Someone who is Arhant or buddha, might not know this higher element.
But, what they know for sure is that six senses causes nothing but suffering to everyone. there is nothing worth experiencing through six senses at all. There is no purpose or meaning of senses at all. All sorts of inputs arises and passes away based on kamma vipakā. Yet, nothing stable, nothing enduring, satisfying.
There is Nothing that can give any being any true permanent security in desert of saṁsāra against all sorts of dangers that prevail here.
Other than dhamma there is no refuge.
So, In summary,
If you find out your house is burning with unstoppable fire, would you try to escape from it or no?
Even if you don’t know what is outside your house, does it matter? Because, there might be some danger outside your house or maybe not. But, would you want to escape from danger that is already present or no?
(Problem in nutshell is arising of senses, solution is eradicating those six root causes responsible for formation of senses.)Saṅkhāra are dukha in beginning, middle and end. They were dukha in past, are dukha in present, will be dukha in future.
To prevent unliked, saṅkhāra are needed.
To get liked, saṅkhāra are needed.To remove arisen unliked, saṅkhāra are needed.
To prevent arisen liked from changing, saṅkhāra are needed.It is constant unnding fight against entropy and laws of kamma.
Question is not whether anything will go under viparinama or no, question is only about when.
Despite doing all type of saṅkhāra for stopping unliked and keeping liked, unliked still comes and liked still slips away.
In present,
There is grief due to past,
(Due to liked things which passed away,
Unliked which couldn’t be stopped.)There is Fear for future
(Whether what one wants will happen, whether what one doesn’t want to happen will be prevented.)Sansarā = constant hanging between grief and fear.
↑ Something I learnt from ven. Ammadassana thero.
Only saṅkhāra which leads to anything meaningful, are kusāla mula saṅkhāra.
Understood, lal. Thank you.
I opened MN152,
At one place it says that one who is in training is,
“They are horrified, repelled, and disgusted by that.”
“So tena uppannena manāpena uppannena amanāpena uppannena manāpāmanāpena aṭṭīyati harāyati jigucchati.”Disgusted by liking, disliking and both,
My question is why?
Why would trainee be horrified, repelled?
Lal, there is this riddle which I don’t understand, can you explain what is solution or what it wrong with this question;
—-
When one has anusuya then,
One cannot stop tanha if one has vedana which can trigger anusuya,
One cannot stop vipaka vēdanā if one has phassa,
One cannot stop phassa if one has indriya,
One cannot stop indriya if one has jati,
One cannot stop jati if one has Bhavā,
One cannot stop bhava if one has upādāna,
One cannot stop upādāna if one has tanha,
One cannot stop tanha if one has vipakā vedana.What is solution here?
You have explained yoniso manasikara previously lal.
But, if you have learnt more details, I request you to please share your learning for benifit of all readers.
Also, Lal, are two ways in which tanha arises as per my understanding, is that correct in first post of this thread?
Lal, Can you also share your understanding about what other ways are there for removing tanha?
Removal of tanha too is subject to casuality,
So what causes leads to decrease in and removal of tanha?Lal, I think you haven’t considered the examples I cited in last post.
By, Subjective I meant, based on gathi/anusuya.
By, conditional I meant, based on states of internal, external Rūpa and external environment AND BHAVĀ.
Even among single Bhavā, there is no object which is universally appealing to everyone.
Even if somehow a universally appealing sense object existed, it still would not be appealing to everyone in THAT bhava, because, difference in their sense faculties.
I said Kama guna is subjective to the particular lifestream. No object has kama guna that is universally appealing or disgusting to everyone, hence, how can It be objective? So, that is what I meant.
Kama guna is conditional because, Even if something is appealing to majority of lifestream in particular bhava, it can not give same vipakā vēdanā to all.
For example, Aged human vs young human have different state of sense, hence, difference in vipakā vēdanā isn’t it?
Beauty is subjective, do you agree or not?
Now, if beauty is subjective (based on gathi) and Arhant has removed the gathi, IN ADDITION he has complete Aniccā saññā AND It is saññā that recognises objects,
How can Arhant recognise it as beautiful?I am not talking about attachment either, lal.
Lal, Another similar question,
When We say something is pleasurable, delightful, good, beautiful etc, those are due to sukha vēdanā,
Opposite conclusions are derived based on dukha vēdanā.However, Recently during contemplate it occured to me, that kama guna, vipakā vēdanā and samphassa-jā-vēdanā all three are PURELY SUBJECTIVE AND CONDITIONAL right?
There is no object for which all beings have niccā saññā. (So, there is no universal kama guna in any objects.) For example, devata might be disgusted with body (that might be appealing to lot of humans.)
There is no object similarly for which all beings have sukha vipaka vedana upon phassa.
(For example, same pizza might seem tasty to young person, but, might not appeal to old person with declined taste faculty.)Samphassa-jā-vēdanā is obviously again both subjective (due to gathi of that being) and conditional (Paṭicca Samuppāda).
So, in summary everything experienced is subjective and conditional and unique to that lifestream.
Which you have said in some post, that pañcakKhanda and PañcaUpādānaKhandha both are unique to that lifestream.)
——–
Question about which I am confused is that,
You said somewhere that even Arhant might “recognise” beautiful women as beautiful women.I don’t understand this.
Because, not all objects are pleasent to everyone, if particular object seem pleasent that is because of GATHI in addition to conditions between external and internal Rūpa.
However, Arhant has no gathi,
In addition he has complete Aniccā saññā,How can he come to such conclusion based on contact with such rupa through eyes, if he has no gathi?
Lal, I am quoting this from MN152: Indriya Bhāvanā sutta,
In that buddha says,
“uppannaṁ kho me idaṁ manāpaṁ, uppannaṁ amanāpaṁ, uppannaṁ manāpāmanāpaṁ.”
Can you explain the meaning of this verse?
Link to referenced sutta:MN152
Theruwan saranayi!!!
Lal, I have a request for you.
When you post an update about updated posts In “general updates” sections, can you also post a small one or two sentence changelog with it about updated posts?
Because sometimes it is hard to keep up with what has been updated in various posts. One has to read through whole post to understand what has been changed or updated.
Thank you for you efforts lal.
Only thanks to you,
So many of us can access such a pristine dhamma in English which alleviates all of us from all our Suffering permanently.1 user thanked author for this post.
Lal, After the first path fruit, various cetasika and citta are removed, this must make lot of defilements and kamma Bijā ineffective right?
Because, majority of kamma Bijā are the ones leading to apāyā, but, those are rendered ineffective with removal of this apāyā leading citta/cetasika at sottapana stage, right?
So, through reasoning a conclusion can be derived.
