Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Thank you for sharing your experience and insights.
You wrote:
“I will watch my thoughts, as they become my words.
I will watch my words, as they become my deeds.
I will watch my deeds, as they become my habits.
I will watch my habits, as they become my character.
I will watch my character, as it becomes my destination by strengthening the fetters.That is how I will train.”
That is an excellent plan. Maybe the last one should be revised as “I will watch my character, as it becomes my destination by weakening the fetters (anusaya/samyojana that give rise to a defiled mind).”
The following could be helpful:
The mind of any average person (puthujjana) in our human world (in ‘kama loka‘) works in a three-stage process when it receives sensory input.
1. Upon receiving sensory input, the mind moves to the ‘kama loka‘ based only on the fact that it still has the ‘kama raga anusaya‘ (same as ‘kama raga samyojana‘) intact. They represent the samsaric (or sansaric) bond to the ‘kama loka.’ This stops only after one attains the Anagami stage of Nibbana.
- With this step, the mind moves to the ‘purana kamma‘ stage.
- Here, ‘purana kamma‘ means ‘initial kamma‘ accumulation. The very early and weak kamma accumulation is with ‘sankappa‘ which are a weak form of sankhara.
2. The next level of ‘kamma accumulation’ (still in the ‘purana kamma‘ stage) depends on the specific sensory input and also on one’s gati (character/habits) at that moment. One’s gati can change even from moment to moment. For example, when one consumes alcohol or drugs, one’s character will change.
- Based on the specific sensory input and one’s gati at that moment, one’s mind begins to accumulate slightly stronger kamma.
- That second stage of kamma accumulation (still in the ‘purana kamma‘ stage) is with ‘sara sankappa‘, a slightly stronger form of sankhara.
Kamma accumulation in stages 1 and 2 happens within a fraction of a second, and we are not even aware of it. Only a Buddha can discover that extremely fast process.
3. If the mind firmly attaches to that sensory input, it reaches the ‘tanha paccaya upadana‘ step in Paticca Samuppada. This is stage 3. With that, the mind enters the ‘nava kamma‘ stage.
- A Paticca Samuppada process starts with “avijja paccaya sankhara‘ and goes through several steps before reaching that ‘tanha paccaya upadana‘ step. It should be clear that those steps happen in the #1 and #2 stages (while in the ‘purana kamma‘ stage) discussed above.
- Stage 3 is where we consciously accumulate strong kamma through body, speech, and mind; these are kaya, vaci, and mano kamma, and the strongest sankhara are generated here.
- Once we become aware of kamma accumulation in this stage, we can wilfully control it. This is the ‘nava kamma‘ (or ‘new kamma‘) accumulation stage where strong kammic energies that can bring vipaka into even future lives are generated.
All sensory inputs force the mind into the ‘purana kamma‘ stage; this is triggered by one of several types of ‘kama saññā’, and it is a deeper aspect to study. Only some of them will proceed to the ‘nava kamma‘ stage, based on the strength of the ‘attachment.’
_______________
That provides a basic outline.
- As we can see, we do not have direct control over the first two sub-stages within the ‘purana kamma‘ stage. However, the Buddha taught how we can do that by fully understanding the details of those two early sub-stages in the ‘purana kamma‘ stage.
- First, we try our best to cultivate ‘good gati‘ and abstain from ‘bad gati.’ See “The Law of Attraction, Habits, Character (Gati), and Cravings (Āsavas)“ and “Habits, Goals, and Character (Gati)“
- To stop the very first stage in #1 above, the ‘kama raga anusaya‘ (same as ‘kama raga samyojana‘) can only be eliminated at the Anagami stage of Nibbana.
- Before that, one must attain the Sotapanna stage by studying the Buddha’s teachings more deeply and cultivating wisdom (paññā).
So, it is a good idea to read those two posts above. More related posts are in “Moral Living and Fundamentals.”
- Also, it is a good idea to start learning Paticca Samuppada. Those last steps mentioned above for attaining the Sotapanna and Anagami stages depend on that.
- See “Paṭicca Samuppāda.” Some posts there need revision. But the ones listed at the top are likely recent or recently revised.
One main point is that we can get considerable relief by changing our gati (pronounced ‘gathi’).
- However, the only permanent solution is to attain the Sotapanna stage. Once that is attained, the subsequent steps (including the Anagami stage) can be attained without the help of others.
Your comments indicate your determination to make progress. Be patient and start learning systematically. I hope the overview above helps in some way.
P.S. By the way, don’t worry about the popping up of <br> in the text. Those are hard to edit out, but I can do that easily.
1 user thanked author for this post.
The following post could also be helpful:
Is It Necessary for a Buddhist to Eliminate Sensual Desires?
This isn’t directed at you, but I think it makes sense for everyone.
1. The mind and the physical body rely on each other. A healthy body is necessary to maintain mental health, and a healthy mind (free of too much greed, anger, and ignorance about the world) helps maintain a healthy body free of ailments.
- This is easy to see in older people who have not paid attention to it over the years. They have not paid attention to eating well and exercising regularly. They have spent most of their time watching porn or movies, sitting on the couch all day.
- A healthy body is essential for mental health. A healthy mind understands the need to maintain a healthy physical body, especially a healthy brain. All our sensory inputs come through the brain. When the brain fails (Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s disease are examples), the mind inevitably fails.
2. I have seen for myself the truth of those general guidelines. Here are some habits I have developed over the years that help me maintain mental and physical health. If one gets sick or spends most of the time in depression, that does not allow enough time to learn and follow Buddha’s teachings.
- Avoid coffee as the first thing in the morning. Drink a glass of water with a bit of lemon juice as the first thing.
- Avoid carb-heavy breakfast foods and choose more protein-rich options. In general, eat healthy foods. By the way, the Buddha did not ask even bhikkhus to abstain from eating meat. But if it bothers one’s conscience, it is better to avoid it; just make sure to get enough supplements to make up the difference.
- Consuming alcohol and drugs are among the worst things one can do, other than eating junk food and not getting enough exercise.
- Exercise regularly. Go for a walk whenever possible, best after a meal. Try to build up to going for a few-mile hike in the woods at least once a week.
- These days, we are fortunate to have AI bots that provide information on health issues, both mental and physical. It is good to have an inquiring mind.
- Of course, spend time learning Buddha’s teachings whenever possible. One can start at a basic level and build up. They go to unbelievable depths. I have spent nearly every day for the past ten to fifteen years learning the teachings, and I am still learning.
3. Living a simple life is a basic foundation for a healthy mind and a healthy body.
- One should be happy to start another day, gaining more wisdom and thereby moving toward a ‘peaceful mind.’
- Many people believe Buddha Dhamma is for depressed people. It is the other way around. A ‘real Buddhist’ is one who is happy and content. They don’t seek too many material possessions. They understand that happiness is entirely in the mind, but a healthy body is also important for maintaining that calm, peaceful mind.
3 users thanked author for this post.
Thank you, Julian, for sharing your journey with us.
You wrote: “But this page and my therapy actually led to yesterdays realisation, that it is not “nothing matters”, but “everything matters”.
- That is profoundly true. Everything matters. You just need to sort out which matters more!
1. By the way, in a related subject, it is beneficial to understand which types of immoral deeds (kamma) one should pay more attention to. Most people worry about killing ants/bugs while walking on the ground, but they don’t hesitate to verbally abuse or physically hurt another human. The latter is a much worse kamma; the first is not really a kamma (or a deed with kammic consequences) because no one has the ‘intention’ of killing ants/bugs while they walk; it just happens.
- See “How to Evaluate Weights of Different Kamma” that I just revised quickly.
2. When the Buddha stated that ‘this world is filled with suffering,’ he meant something deeper than just the ‘feeling of pain with an injury or a sickness or even depression.’
- All living beings are trapped in a rebirth process among 31 realms. We can only ‘see’ two realms: the human and animal realms.
- In the long run, any living being spends the most time in one of the four lowest realms (apayas). Since we can see the suffering animals in the wild experience (not the dogs or cats living among humans), we can get an idea of the possible suffering.
- I need to revise more of my older posts on the basics. It is just that I’ve focused on deeper aspects of Buddha’s teachings over the past 3-4 years, and I am still uncovering more.
- My apologies to all those who are new to Buddha’s teachings. Most of the new posts over the past few years require a deeper understanding of Buddha’s teachings.
3. For the benefit of those who are fairly new to Buddha’s teachings, the following sections could be ‘easier to digest’ and also may provide the necessary background: ” Moral Living and Fundamentals,” “Living Dhamma” and “Dhammapada.”
- Just scan through the post titles and select ones that seem interesting/informative.
- For those with a scientific background, the “Dhamma and Science” section could be informative.
- Please don’t hesitate to ask questions. It would be helpful to provide the link or at least the title of the post if the question(s) relate to a specific post.
Another old post on kamma, just revised:
Several hours ago, I posted “Idappaccayatā Paṭicca Samuppāda – Bhava and Jāti Within a Lifetime.”
- Just before posting this comment, I made a few minor revisions. So, those who already went through the post may want to re-read it, especially if there were unresolved issues.
- Hopefully, this rewritten post will help clarify the basic/fundamental concepts.
- Note that Idappaccayatā Paṭicca Samuppāda intrinsically explains the ‘purāna kamma‘ and ‘nava kamma‘ stages of mind contamination, and how that ‘purāna kamma‘ stage gets started with ‘viparita (distorted) saññā.’
- Feel free to ask questions. That is the only way to resolve any issues that I may have overlooked.
I simply do not understand the point you are trying to make.
- Of course, “puñña mula paccayā saṅkhāro” is valid; see my comment above. That is the standard Paticca Samuppada process, even though it is not usually written like that. It leads to rebirths in the ‘good realms.’
- In other words, “puñña mula” is also “avijjā.” Since puñña kamma also fuels the rebirth cycle, “puñña mula paccayā saṅkhāro” is the same as “avijjā paccayā saṅkhāro”
__________________
The point of the new post, “Kusalamūla Paṭicca Samuppāda – Evidence Against It”, is to say there cannot be a Paticca Samuppada process with “kusalamūla paccayā saṅkhāra.” Do you have any evidence against that?
__________________
Note: Even though I initially wrote, “Furthermore, there is not a single sutta with a verse including “puñña mula paccayā saṅkhāro” OR “kusalamūla paccayā saṅkhāro”
- I revised it to the following immediately at that time: Furthermore, there is not a single sutta with a verse including “kusalamūla paccayā saṅkhāro.” Of course, “puñña mula paccayā saṅkhāro” is valid. But they lead to more rebirths, not to Nibbāna.”
The critical problem with your suggestion is the following:
You wrote: (1) Replace “kusalamūla paccayā saṅkhāro” with “puñña mula paccayā saṅkhāro”
- You missed the main point in today’s post, “Kusalamūla Paṭicca Samuppāda – Evidence Against It.”
- The point is that one cannot attain Nibbana by engaging in puñña kamma. Please specifically read #3 there.
- Also, read the following post, which was a recommended link there: “Six Root Causes – Loka Samudaya (Arising of Suffering) and Loka Nirodhaya (Nibbāna).” As explained in detail there, any puñña kamma also extends the cycle of rebirth. They can lead to rebirth in the ‘good realms’ at or above the human realm, but NOT to Nibbāna.
- Furthermore, there is not a single sutta with a verse including “kusalamūla paccayā saṅkhāro.” Of course, “puñña mula paccayā saṅkhāro” is valid. But they lead to more rebirths, not to Nibbāna.
P.S. The following sutta explains how various types of puñña kamma lead to rebirth in corresponding ‘good realms’: “Puññakiriyavatthu Sutta (AN 8.36).”
I just posted the final version of the draft at the beginning of this thread: “Kusalamūla Paṭicca Samuppāda – Evidence Against It“
- Please feel free to comment or ask questions.
I have revised an old post on that subject: “Six Root Causes – Loka Samudaya (Arising of Suffering) and Loka Nirodhaya (Nibbāna).”
- I hope that would help. Feel free to ask questions. These issues must be resolved.
We can say raga, dosa, moha or the mundane versions of alobha, adosa, amoha arise in a mind based on avijja.
- Avijja is eliminated by comprehending that all ‘sensory pleasures’ are mind-made and, thus, are of anicca nature. That anicca nature also leads to dukkha (suffering), and thus attaching to such ‘mind-made sensory pleasures’ are of anatta nature. That leads to the lokottara version of alobha, adosa, amoha.
- One becomes a Sotapanna by seeing the truth of that.
- But a Sotapanna still attaches to those sensory pleasures with tanha and mana. They have eliminated only ditthi. That is why they must cultivate Satipatthana to eliminate tanha and mana. Both of those are are eliminated at the Arahant stage. An Anagami eliminates only part of tanha involving the kama loka; they still have tanha for (mind-made) jhanic/samapatti ‘pleasures’ in rupa and arupa loka. See “Etaṁ Mama, Esohamasmi, Eso Me Attā’ti – Connection to Taṇhā, Māna, Diṭṭhi.”
- Avijja (and tanha, mana, ditthi) is totally eliminated only at the Arahant stage.
1 user thanked author for this post.
Yes. All rebirths among the 31 realms arise due to six root causes: (i) lobha, dosa, moha on the ‘immoral side’ lead to rebirths in the apāyās, and (ii) mundane versions of alobha, adosa, amoha on the ‘moral side’ lead to rebirths in the rest, which are ‘relatively good.’
- Magga phala can be attained only with lokuttara versions of alobha, adosa, amoha, i.e., based on the comprehension of anicca, dukkha, and anatta nature.
We can clarify this by understanding what is meant by ‘kamma‘ and ‘cetana‘ in the suttas.
1. In the Buddha Dhamma, ‘kamma‘ means actions, speech, and thoughts that are based on raga, dosa, or moha. Only those can lead to vipaka.
- Thus, they include punna kamma, apunna kamma, and akusala kamma.
- Therefore, walking to the kitchen to get a glass of water is not an act of kamma.
- An Arahant offering part of his meal to a hungry person is also not a kamma, since that action was not based on raga, dosa, or moha (even though it would be a punna kamma for a puthujjana).
2. That is also why ‘cetana‘ in the suttas really means ‘ sancetana‘, or ‘intentions rooted in raga, dosa, or moha.’
- See #2 of “Details of Kamma – Intention, Who Is Affected, Kamma Patha.”
- Sañcetanā are ‘defiled intentions,’ and actions, speech, and thoughts based on them are abhisankhara. Thus, only those actions, speech, and thoughts that belong to punna kamma, apunna kamma, and akusala kamma involve abhisankhara. Also see #1 above.
3. Therefore, it is necessary to keep in mind those two issues discussed above when reading suttas.
______________
4. Therefore, only sankhara (devoid of raga, dosa, or moha) and NOT abhisankhara can arise in an Arahant.
- The same is true for anyone (Sotapanna or above) while their minds are in the Satipaṭṭhāna Bhūmi. No abhisankhara generation there, either.
5. Please ask further questions if anything is unclear.
You are absolutely correct, Tobias.
- Even ‘puñña kamma‘ (with sobhana cetasika) are done with avijjā.
- I made a mistake there.
- Just below that, I made the correct statement: While in the Satipaṭṭhāna Bhūmi, one would only examine the steps in Paṭicca Samuppāda or anicca, dukkha, anatta, or the Four Noble Truths. In other words, how the mind becomes defiled, starting with the ‘distorted saññā‘ (various types of kāma saññā in our kāma loka; a ‘rupa loka Brahma‘ would contemplate the role of types of saññā that arise in the rupa loka).
- That does not involve any sobhana cetasika either. In fact, here the paññā cetasika ‘graduates to a ñāna‘ for a Sotapanna, which is the first āsvakkhaya ñāna.
- The transition from the highest levels of vijānāti (with paññā) to pajānātī happens at the Sotāpanna Anugami stage; pajānātī is not a superficial understanding but rather with paññā cakkhu (as a Sotāpanna Anugami), which then turns to ‘dhamma cakkhu’ (at an even higher level of abhijānātī) at the Sotāpanna stage. See #8 and #9 in “Mahāvedalla Sutta – Sañjānātī, Vijānāti, Pajānāti.”
- Thank you for pointing that out. This is why comments are useful.
P.S. When one becomes a Sotapanna (and is actively cultivating the Noble Path), all the mental factors on the mundane eightfold path (i.e., sobhana cetasika) are elevated to lokottara versions. For example, paññā is elevated to the ñāna level, and sati (mundane mindfulness) is elevated to Samma Sati. Of course, that would happen ONLY WHEN a Sotapanna‘s mind is in the Satipaṭṭhāna Bhūmi (and he/she is actively cultivating the Noble Path). Two other critical mental factors (cetasika), vitakka and vicara, turn to dhamma vitakka/vicara, i.e., critically examining Dhamma concepts.
1 user thanked author for this post.
