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Yes. Lang’s description requires a good understanding of Paticca Samuppada.
You can see that most current translators of Paticca Samuppada from Pali to English do not understand these necessary detailed explanations.
– See, “Distortion of Pāli Keywords in Paṭicca Samuppāda”They simply translate “avijjā paccayā saṅkhārā, saṅkhāra paccayā viññāṇa,” as “Ignorance is a condition for choices. Choices are a condition for consciousness.” Then they translate the Patiloma (Reverse) Paticca Samuppada of “avijjā nirodhā saṅkhāra nirodho, saṅkhāra nirodhā viññāṇa nirodho” as “When ignorance ceases, choices cease. When choices cease, consciousness ceases.”
– That does not make sense since an Arahant would still generate saṅkhāra and would still have consciousness!
– They need to explain that the niddesa version of Paticca Samuppada is, “avijjā paccayā abhisaṅkhārā, abhisaṅkhāra paccayā kammaviññāṇa,” Several other terms need to be expanded.
– Then, they need to further explain each term in detail, as I pointed out in my earlier post.See, also, “Sutta Interpretation – Uddēsa, Niddēsa, Paṭiniddēsa“
The problem got worse in recent days. You may have seen many hits to the “Redirection page.”
Seng Kiat Ng, co-administrator of this website, has figured out the problem.
As he stated, “This problem is related to the diacritic character of Pāli’s word in the URL links where previously it was working fine. Those URL links with diacritic characters are not recognized and return a Redirection Page.”
He is painstakingly making the necessary corrections, and many of those links are working now.
But, as he stated, “it may take some time to do it as there are many such URL links with the diacritic character.”Much merits to Seng Kiat for his dedication!
That is an excellent way to put it, Lang!
Those “mental aspects/qualities” arise when a set of rupa (that once one experienced, plans to experience, or currently experience) is “kept close in one’s mind” (i.e., one has upādāna for them).
As one progresses on the Noble Path, that set will keep shrinking.
– An Arahant would not upādāna any component of rupakkhandha.
– Note that memories of past rupa in rupakkhandha experienced with the mind directly, via “manañca paṭicca dhamme ca uppajjāti manoviññāṇaṃ.” See #4 of, “Vipāka Vēdanā and “Samphassa jā Vēdanā” in a Sensory Event.”
– Understanding these details lead to getting rid of sakkāya diṭṭhi. See, “Paṭicca Samuppāda – A “Self” Exists Due to Avijjā”
– That whole process is discussed systematically in “Worldview of the Buddha.” The above two posts are part of this section.P.S. To emphasize: All attachments start with an ārammaṇa, i.e., sensory contacts between an internal rupa and external rupa. (six types, including mana/dhamma).
– But attachment happens via all five aggregates of rupa, vedanā, saññā, saṅkhāra, and viññāṇa. It is important to see the details as explained by Lang.
– That is why it is “pañca upādāna khandhā.”I may have to re-write that whole post with a new title. That may take a few days.
But I have revised #1 as follows:
“For example, the concept of anicca is understood gradually—from the Sotapanna Anugāmi stage to the Sotāpanna stage. Then how that anicca nature leads to suffering (dukkha) is fully grasped in stages — strengthening at the Sakadāgāmi and Anāgāmi stages — and is fully comprehended at the Arahant stage.”This is a subtle point.
Not all sensory experiences are bad and bring bad outcomes (kamma vipaka).
– Just because one eats a tasty meal does not mean that it is bad. The Buddha accepted such meals from wealthy people.
– What matters is whether one generates greed when eating such a meal.
– In the case of watching a movie, there is a big difference between watching an adult movie with lust and watching an educational/informative movie.The easiest way to decide is to see what kinds of feelings are associated with a given event. If it involves greed, anger, hate, jealousy, etc. then those will bring bad vipaka.
The following post could be helpful: “Is It Necessary for a Buddhist to Eliminate Sensual Desires?“
Thanks. I revised #10 there:
“Five Aggregates – Experiences of Each Sentient Being“Thanks. I will see which posts will benefit from that.
– If you have a specific post in mind, please let me know.Yes. That sentence needs to be revised. Thanks for pointing that out.
That is an old post. I need to spend some time bringing it up to date. I will post here when done.
1. Jarā means “getting old.”
“Marana” means “death.”As we know, all births (jāti) lead to old age and eventual death.
– See, “Bhava paccayā Jāti….Jarā , Marana,…”
– The above is the general description of jāti, jarā, and marana. That applies to uppatti Paticca Samuppada, where the focus is on old age and death (after being born a baby).2. I see that you are asking specifically about Idappaccayātā Paticca Samuppada.
– That specific version describes the moment-to-moment evolution of events during a lifetime.
– For example, one may be “born” in an “angry jāti” or a “greedy jāti” for a relatively short time. But that “state” also wears out (jarā) and ends (marana).
– For example, one may get angry about something. But that anger wears out and dies within minutes or hours.
– See, “Paṭicca Samuppāda During a Lifetime”Please feel free to ask questions if not clear.
I just posted a new post that makes further clarifications:
Four Types of Births in BuddhismPlease feel free to ask questions or make comments.
You are correct, dosakkhayo. Thanks for pointing that out.
– P.S. So it turns out you had the correct understanding too. Sadhu! Sadhu!! Sadhu!!!1. I just listened to that part, which was an error. I have added a note under that discourse to correct it as:
“Immoral deeds or dasa akusala are done with apuññābhisaṅkhāra or bad thoughts in our minds. Good deeds (or puññābhisaṅkhāra) done with the comprehension of the Four Noble Truths/Paṭicca Samuppāda/Tilakkhana become kusala kamma due to that understanding.”2. It turned out that I also did not have the correct link to the series of discourses in my first post above. I also corrected the link:
“Tilakkhana – English Discourses”
– You can see the above correction there under Discourse 4.Dosakkhayo wrote:
“And 36:53
So, it is important to make this connection. Our sankhara and specifically abhisankhara lead to future lives based on whether they involve dasa akusala or dasa kusala.”– What I said is technically correct. But I can see why that could lead to confusion.
The following comment by LayDhammaFollower provides a good explanation: “There is no such thing as kusāla abhisaṅkhāra. Abhisaṅkhāra either puñña or Apuñña, are done out of ignorance.”
Let me clarify that a bit more.
– Puñña kamma (good, moral deeds done WITHOUT understanding the Four Noble Truths/Paticca Samuppada/Tilakkhana) are NOT kusala kamma. Since avijja (ignorance) about the real nature of this world is still present, such good deeds have underlying expectations for “good returns in this world,” such as getting a “good rebirth where one can enjoy life.”
– The same good, moral deeds by a person WITH an understanding of the Four Noble Truths/Paticca Samuppada/Tilakkhana AUTOMATICALLY BECOME kusala kamma.
– P.S. That change in understanding comes at the Sotapanna Anugami stage, where one starts grasping the danger of getting a rebirth in any realm of this world. That is when one first gets to Samma Ditthi and starts on the lokuttara path to Nibbana. Until then, anyone just doing puñña kamma is on the mundane Eightfold path. Also see “Vipallāsa (Diṭṭhi, Saññā, Citta) Affect Saṅkhāra”That is a critical point to understand.
– In the absence of the correct Buddha Dhamma, people may do puñña kamma, but they are UNABLE to do kusala kamma.
– It is ONLY when one understands the not only unfruitful but also DANGEROUS nature of continuing the rebirth process that one will be able to convert the same puñña kamma to kusala kamma. That involves only a change of mindset!Please read the post, “Kusala and Akusala Kamma, Puñña and Pāpa Kamma” and ask more questions if not clear.
– It is a subtle but CRITICAL point to understand.By the way, I am quite impressed by the progress of LayDhammaFollower. I learned that he is only 23 years old. Sadhu! Sadhu!! Sadhu!!!
Tobias wrote: “Thus this “chemical base” + gandhabba (patisandhi vinnana) is the “origin of life” with a dense body. It is only that modern science does not know the gandhabba is required, right?”
Yes. That is correct.
– We see a lot of confusion these days about “when a baby can be called human”?
– In the US, there are many “theories” about when a baby becomes “fully conscious.” Then that evolves into arguments about “a baby not being human” up to a few days, a few months, or even at birth. Some even speculate that since a child cannot “think rationally” until at least a couple of years of age, they may not be “human.” How ridiculous is that?A zygote in a womb becomes human as soon as a gandhabba merges with it!
– See “Buddhist Explanations of Conception, Abortion, and Contraception”Tobias asked: “What is spontaneous reproduction of “certain humans” and “certain beings in the lower realms”?”
– There are a couple of accounts in the Tipitaka where a human baby was born on a flower. Here, it is a saṁsedaja birth. I think bhikkhuni Uppalavaṇṇā, who became an Arahant, was born on a flower. That means a zygote assembled on a flower by natural means (chemical composition), and the gandhabba of Uppalavaṇṇā merged with that zygote. That is an extremely rare event.
– There are some petas (or pretas) and niraya beings who are born spontaneously (in the final form), just like the Devas and Brahmas.In MN12 that you referenced, the four types of yoni (ways of birth) are stated:
“Sāriputta, there are these four kinds of reproduction” (Catasso kho imā, sāriputta, yoniyo.)”A better translation would be: “Sāriputta, there are these four kinds of births”
The sutta states those four kinds as, “Aṇḍajā yoni, jalābujā yoni, saṁsedajā yoni, opapātikā yoni” which can be translated as “Born from an egg, from a womb, from moisture, or spontaneously.”
In a way, ALL births (that take place at the cuti-patisandhi moment) are opapātika or spontaneous births.
– The “four modes of birth” apply to mainly humans and animals.
– The manomaya kaya/gandhabba created spontaneously by kammic energy can lead to “births with physical bodies” in the other three ways.Thus, the “seed” for the other three modes comes from the manomaya kaya/gandhabba.
– For humans, a gandhabba gets into a womb and is born with a physical body. That is the “jalābujā yoni” or “birth from a womb” with “breaking out of the amniotic sac.”
– For animals, all three modes apply. Some (monkeys, deer, etc) are born like humans (jalābujā yoni“); Chicken, birds, etc. are born from an egg (aṇḍajā yoni). The last mode of saṁsedajā yoni is rare for big animals and applies mostly to smaller ones. Here the required “chemical base” for the gandhabba happens naturally in rotten meat or leaves.
– Note that in all three of those modes, a “seed” (manomaya kaya/gandhabba) must have been first produced by kammic energy.Also, note that in all realms above the human realm, all births involve one step, i.e., spontaneous birth (opapātika) via kammic energy.
Well done! Thank you for sharing with us.
– Others may want to express their insights/comments, especially looking from different angles.Note-taking helps clarify concepts. From my school days, I have tried to write down what I learned in my own words. In a way, that is what I am doing on this website too. As the understanding grows, one can express a given concept better.
– Trying to put ideas into words helps clarify. Just reading through a post is not enough. At least one should contemplate new concepts and try to express them in one’s own words. That is Vipassanā! Then one can compile notes.
