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He is talking about words used in ancient times. I am not familiar with most of them. I don’t know whether those are correct.
- Regarding “atto” is applied as a suffix to living objects, I have not heard that.
- However, in some villages, “atto” is applied to a “person” (actually as “attā”; it is not pronounced the same way as ‘atta’ in ‘anatta’: ඇත්තා as in ‘මේ ඇත්තා’ or ‘this person’).
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At the end of my above comment, I wrote the following:
Even though I was discussing attaining the Sotapanna stage, the process can also be used to cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna, as mentioned at the beginning of my comment.
- However, it may not happen in a few sittings. Furthermore, one needs to grasp the fundamentals necessary and also live a moral life, i.e., cultivate sila.
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1. Cultivation of Satipaṭṭhāna (to access the ‘kāma saññā free’ Satipaṭṭhāna Bhūmi) by a Sotapanna is a bit more involved than I implied above. There are suttās that describe the required steps in detail.
- Before getting into that process, I think it is beneficial for most people (who may be puthujjana or Sotapanna Anugāmi) to understand the critical foundations of the Buddha’s teachings.
- In particular, I think it is not enough to understand that cravings for ‘worldly pleasures’ must be given up to attain Nibbāna.
- It is easier to give up the cravings for ‘worldly pleasures’ if one understands that external sights, sounds, tastes, etc, actually do not deliver those ‘pleasures.’
- The ‘sense of a pleasure’ arises from saññā built into us (all living beings) and from our external environments via Paṭicca Samuppāda.
- That is why I keep working to explain that deeper aspect.
2. When that framework is understood, it becomes easier to attain the Sotapanna stage and also to cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna.
- One of the steps in cultivating Satipaṭṭhāna is to cultivate ‘Indriya bhāvanā‘ or the ‘Restrain of Sense Faculties.’ It is explained in the “Indriyabhāvanā Sutta (MN 152),” for example. Let me explain the key ideas in that sutta to give an idea of why that ‘solid foundation’ is critically important.
3. In the days of the Buddha, other teachers (such as Alara Kalama) also taught ‘Indriya bhāvanā.‘ We all know that our Bodhisatta learnt cultivation of anariya jhāna from yogis like Alara Kalama before attaining Buddhahood with his own efforts.
- Such yogis realized that attachment to sense pleasures leads to bad outcomes, and that even forcefully abstaining from them can lead one to transcend the ‘kāma loka‘ and enjoy ‘jhānic pleasures’ associated with the Brahma realms. To achieve that, they went deep into the jungles to avoid enticing sensory stimuli such as tasty food, luxury houses, and women. However, our Bodhisatta realized that such efforts yield only temporary solutions. Such yogis will be reborn in a Brahma realm, but they may still be reborn in the apāyās in the future, since they had not broken the samsāric bonds associated with kāma rāga.
- Those yogis did not know that the way to be permanently free of the ‘kāma loka‘ is to comprehend how we attach to such sensory pleasures via ‘distorted saññā‘, which in this case is ‘kāma saññā.’ When one fully understands that process, one can cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna to become permanently free of the kāma loka and attain the Anāgāmi state. That is one way to explain the ‘previously unheard teachings’ of a Buddha.
4. In the above sutta, Uttara, a pupil of the brahmin Pārāsariya (a yogi like Alara Kalama), came to the Buddha and asked how the Buddha teaches ‘Indriya bhāvanā‘ to the bhikkhus.
- The Buddha, in turn, asked Uttara how his teacher taught him the ‘Indriya bhāvanā.‘
- Uttara’s answer was what I explained in #3 above, i.e., to ‘stay away from such sensory pleasures’ or to live like a blind person (who would not see such attractive sights), a deaf person (who would not hear such attractive sounds), etc. One can do that by living deep in the jungles.
- Then the Buddha (@marker 2.8) tells Uttara, “In that case, Uttara, a blind person and a deaf person will have developed sense faculties without any effort.” Such people do not crave attractive sights or sounds while they are deaf, but in future lives (when they are born with eyes and ears) they will have those cravings. Until the ‘kāma rāga samyojana‘ is broken with wisdom, one is not free of rebirths in the ‘kāma loka.’
- Then the Buddha explained the correct way to control the sensory faculties. We will discuss that in the future. It involves understanding how the ‘kāma saññā‘ arises via Paṭicca Samuppāda.
- But first, it is critically important to understand the role of saññā in our built-in attachments to so-called ‘sensory pleasures.’
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Yes. Both following goals can be attained in focused formal meditation sessions: (i) Attaining the Sotapanna stage, and (ii) Cultivating Satipaṭṭhāna to enter the Satipaṭṭhāna Bhumi to attain higher magga phala.
- I discussed that in the post “First Stage of Ānāpānasati – Seeing the Anicca Nature of ‘Kāya’” in the following section:
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Attaining the Sotapanna Phala
12. Even though most people attained the Sotapanna stage while listening to a single discourse by the Buddha, attaining the Sotapanna phala moment can happen anytime, anywhere, while contemplating. Of course, one must have learned the necessary Dhamma concepts (especially the ‘anicca nature’ of the world) from a Noble Person (an Ariya).
- The “Vimuttāyatana Sutta (AN 5.26)” describes five ways of attaining magga phala: (i) while learning Dhamma from a Noble teacher, (ii) while the person himself teaches Dhamma to others, (iii) and (iv) while the person is contemplating in detail Dhamma concepts learned from a Noble teacher. and (v) while fully immersed in a meditation subject (samādhi nimitta). Note that (ii) and (v) hold only for a Noble Person attaining higher magga phala. The other three also hold for puthujjana striving for the Sotapanna stage.
- Therefore, what matters is grasping the relevant Dhamma concepts and breaking the respective saṁyojana.
- We can look at two accounts from the Tipiṭaka to verify the above. Venerable Koṇḍañña attained the Sotapanna phala moment while contemplating the Dhamma he learnt from the first discourse delivered by the Buddha. Another is that of Ven. Cittahattha attained the Sotapanna phala moment while walking to the monastery to become a bhikkhu for the seventh time; along the way, he reflected on the Dhamma he had learned and realized the Sotapanna phala. See “Four Conditions for Attaining Sotāpanna Magga/Phala.”
Setting Aside a Day for the Effort
13. Therefore, one could, in principle, attain the Sotapanna stage within an intensely focused effort within even a day.
- As we have discussed, it requires: (i) learning about the ‘anicca nature’ of the world from a Buddha or a true disciple of the Buddha (a Noble Person) and then (ii) fully comprehending it with wisdom.
- Those two steps are called ‘jānato‘ (come to know about) and ‘passato‘ (seeing the truth of that with ‘dhamma cakkhu‘ or ‘with wisdom’).
- See “‘Jānato Passato’ and Ājāniya – Critical Words to Remember.”
Uposatha Sutta
14. This is why it is customary in the Buddhist countries to allocate a day (usually the Full Moon Day each month) to focus on this objective. They usually observe the ‘eight precepts’ or even the ‘ten precepts.’
- They spend the day listening to discourses and engaging in Vipassanā.
- In the days of the Buddha, this was called ‘uposatha.’ It can also be done to attain higher magga phala for a Sotapanna.
- The Buddha explained to Visākhā how to practice the correct version of ‘uposatha‘ in the “Uposatha Sutta (AN 3.70).” Apparently, there were two other wrong versions practiced at the time.
- Note that ‘uposatha‘ is translated as ‘Sabbath’ in the English translation. In Abrahamic religions, the Sabbath is a day set aside for rest and worship. That does not convey the meaning of Buddhist ‘uposatha.’
- The correct version of the ‘uposatha‘ description starts at marker 4.1.
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Even though I was discussing attaining the Sotapanna stage, the process can also be used to cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna, as mentioned at the beginning of my comment.
- However, it may not happen in a few sittings. Furthermore, one needs to grasp the fundamentals necessary and also live a moral life, i.e., cultivate sila.
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Good questions.
1. The word ‘anusotagāmi’ (‘anu sota gāmi’) means to stay engaged (‘gāmi’) with (“anu”) the flow of the rebirth process (‘sota’). Thus, the mind of an ‘anusotagāmi’ initiates a pañcupādānakkhandha process (equivalently, a Paṭicca Samuppāda process) upon receiving a sense input. The growth of the pañcupādānakkhandha is shown in the following chart.
- The growth of the pañcupādānakkhandha is from left to right in the above chart for an ‘Anusotagāmi.’ See “Growth of Pañcupādānakkhandha – ‘Anusotagāmi’.”
- When cultivating Satipaṭṭhāna (i.e., for a Paṭisotagāmi), one’s mind must move in the opposite direction. When someone sits down to cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna, their mind is already in the ‘expanded’ nava kamma stage. They must start moving the mind from the right to the left toward the Satipaṭṭhāna Bhumi.
- In that process, one encounters the ajjhatta kaya (with ajjhatta viññāṇa) before the bahiddha kaya (with bahiddha viññāṇa)
- Eventually, the mind overcomes the kāma saññā(temporarily) and jumps over to the Satipaṭṭhāna Bhumi.
- See #7 of “Paṭisotagāmi – Moving Toward Satipaṭṭhāna Bhumi and Nibbāna.”
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2. Tobias wrote the following in the second question/answer:
In which step does “Cakkhuñca paticca rūpe ca uppajjati cakkhu viññāṇaṁ” occur? Am I correct in understanding it as stated below?
– bahidda kaya: avijja paccaya sankhara, sankhara paccaya vinnana, vinnana paccaya namarupa
– ajjhatta kaya: namarupa paccaya salayatana, … vedana paccaya tanha
Is namarupa the “mind-made rupa” (rūpe) that develops with cakkhu to cakkhu vinnana?
The first part of bahidda kaya is processed by intact samjoyana (avijja and kamaraga), right? Gati are added via sanphassa?
Thus, the PS steps from avijja… to …tanha happen in a split second._____________
- Excellent! Yes. That explains the first part of the Paṭicca Samuppāda (PS) process. Let me provide a bit more information for the benefit of all.
- By the time cakkhu vinnana arises, both bahiddha and ajjhatta stages are complete, and cakkhu ayatana (with cakkhu vinnana) has arisen. That is Step 1 in the above chart. That also indicates PS processes from ‘“avijjā paccayā saṅkhāra’ through ‘nāmarūpa paccayā salāyatana.’
- Step 2 is ‘tiṇṇaṃ saṅgati phasso‘ in the chart, which corresponds to ‘salāyatana paccayā phassō‘ in PS. The verse ‘tiṇṇaṃ saṅgati phasso‘ appears in the “Chachakka Sutta (MN 148),” and is explained in #5 of “Indriya Make Phassa and Ayatana Make Samphassa.”
- Step 3 in the chart describes the PS steps of ‘phassa paccayā vēdanā, vēdanā paccayā taṇhā.’
- As you stated, all that will happen in the ‘anusotagāmi’ process within a split second. A mind will go through the ‘purāna kamma‘ stage in the blink of an eye.
- Once going through the ‘taṇhā paccayā upādāna‘ step, the mind can spend a lot more time engaging in akusala kamma, generating kammic energy. That is the ‘nava kamma‘ stage. This is where kammic energy for future rebirths/vipāka are generated via the ‘upādāna paccayā bhavō‘ step. Also see “Upādāna Paccayā Bhava – Two Types of Bhava.” This is Step 4 in the above chart. P.S. The ‘expanded cone’ for the ‘nava kamma‘ stage compared to the ‘smaller cone’ for the ‘purāna kamma‘ stage is meant to express this difference in kamma accumulation.
Anyone can ask follow-up questions. Tobias has pointed out some critical points.
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Yes. May be it can be a bit refined as follows.
1. Anything that arises in the world (living beings and their environments) is a saṅkhata, meaning it has a finite lifetime and is subject to unexpected changes during that lifetime. That is because they all arise from kammic energies generated by the minds of living beings. Inert things in the environment arise due to collective kammic energies, while one’s own existences arise due to their own kammic energies.
- That is why nothing can be of nicca, sukha, atta nature. They are all of anicca, dukkha, anatta nature.
- That process is dictated by Paṭicca Samuppāda. Thus, nature runs based on the universal law of Paṭicca Samuppāda.
2. Five types of niyāma (utu, bīja, citta, kamma, dhamma) are not discussed in the Sutta Piṭaka or the Abhidhamma Piṭaka. At least I have not come across them. They appear only in late Commentaries.
- There is only one niyāma (dhamma niyāma) that is discussed. See “Uppādā Sutta (AN 3.126)“. That is Paṭicca Samuppāda.
- There is an old thread on the subject in the forum: “Five Niyamas-Does Every Unfortunate Event Always Have Kamma As A Root Cause?“
3. Living beings engage in akusala kamma (and generate kammic energies) by generating abhisankhara because of their efforts to enjoy ‘sensory pleasures.’
- However, all such ‘pleasures’ are mind-made (via Paṭicca Samuppāda). That means all ‘sensual pleasures’ in kama loka, ‘jhanic pleasures’ in rupa loka, and ‘arupa samapatti pleasures’ in arupa loka are all mind-made. We suffer in the rebirth process because we do not understand that all these ‘pleasures’ are like mirages! They feel like ‘pleasures’, but if you chase them, you will not find any lasting happiness.
- This is a bit complex subject that I discussed in several sections (in the following order): “Does ‘Anatta’ Refer to a ‘Self’?” “Sensory Experience – A Deeper Analysis” “Sotapanna Stage via Understanding Perception (Saññā)” “Buddha Dhamma – Advanced” “Meditation – Deeper Aspects” “Worldview of the Buddha” and “Satipaṭṭhāna Sutta – New Series”.
- This is why our actions seeking such ‘pleasures’ are all of anicca, dukkha, anatta nature. They are not only fruitless but also dangerous because they can lead to rebirths in the apāyās.
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Jittananto wrote: ” I recommend that everyone unfamiliar with this concept watch the sermon as a whole to gain a deeper understanding.”
1. I listened to the whole discourse last night.
- That discourse gives a superficial understanding of saññā (perception). By the way, the word ‘saññā‘ is not even mentioned.
- It does not provide “a deeper understanding.”
- So, I am not saying that discourse is useless, but it does not provide any additional information on what I am trying to convey.
2. You did not grasp that deeper meaning when you wrote the previous long comment either.
- That is why I wrote the following in response to it.
“You wrote: “Because of Ignorance (Avijja), we believe the Samsara is pleasurable, therefore we attach (Ragā) ourselves to the 31 realms.”
- Yes. We can say that avijja is the ignorance of the role played by the (distorted) saññā, which is ‘kāma saññā‘ in our kāma loka.
- Without colors, tastes, smells, etc. (generated via ‘kāma saññā‘), we would not crave anything in the kāma loka. Thus, ‘kāma saññā‘ is the trigger for our attachments.
- I tried to explain that in the post What Does “Paccayā” Mean in Paṭicca Samuppāda? “
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3. Anyway, I will write more on this critical issue when I start a new series on the pañcupādānakkhandha.
- I wonder how many people grasped the concept. Of course, not all participate in the forum.
- When people post discourses that are not really relevant to the point I am trying to make, it diverts the focus. Of course, I understand that everyone has good intentions.
- Buddha’s teachings are much deeper than many believe. Again, my goal is not a wider audience but to get at least a few to the Sotapanna stage.
Where does the Thero talk about saññā?
- When you provide a link to a given subject, please point out the relevant timestamps.
Tobias asked: “Why is a physical body necessary for distorted sanna and hence kamma generation?”
- A human gandhabba is the essence of a human. It has ‘distorted saññā‘ (i.e., kāma saññā).
- It is just that it cannot fulfil its desires for tastes, smells, and touches since it does not have a physical body.
- Since it does not have a physical body, it cannot engage in killing, stealing, or sexual misconduct. But even though it cannot speak out, it can still generate vaci kamma with vaci saṅkhāra. See #7 of “Correct Meaning of Vacī Sankhāra.” Even though it is unable to do the three types of kamma with the physical body, a gandhabba still generates the urge to engage in them, i.e., generate vaci saṅkhāra. Thus, it probably lives a frustrated life.
- Therefore, it can still generate kammic energies through vaci saṅkhāra and mano saṅkhāra. It is just unable to carry out some of the wishes.
I hope the above answers questions in DammaSponge’s mind. If not, feel free to ask any remaining questions.
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Good summary!
You wrote: “Because of Ignorance (Avijja), we believe the Samsara is pleasurable, therefore we attach (Ragā) ourselves to the 31 realms.”
- Yes. We can say that avijja is the ignorance of the role played by the (distorted) saññā, which is ‘kāma saññā‘ in our kāma loka.
- Without colors, tastes, smells, etc. (generated via ‘kāma saññā‘), we would not crave anything in the kāma loka. Thus, ‘kāma saññā‘ is the trigger for our attachments.
- I tried to explain that in the post What Does “Paccayā” Mean in Paṭicca Samuppāda?
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I made several revisions to the above post since it was first posted. Please feel free to comment/ask questions.
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1. To really understand the ‘anicca nature,’ one must understand the concept of ‘saññā.’
- ‘Saññā‘ is an ‘innate sense’ that is built into our bodies. The simplest idea is in the loose translation of saññā as ‘perception’ (in the sense of two people having different ‘perceptions of a third person (X), i.e., one says X is a good person and the other says X is a ‘bad person’). A bit deeper example is birds flying long distances over thousand of miles based on their built-in saññā that they need to fly to a different location to survive the upcoming weather change; they just ‘feel’ they need to start flying in a certain direction for a certain time!
- Here is an even more complex version of saññā: Seeing colors is a ‘saññā,’ and that is a mirage, according to the Buddha. The color of an object is not real. Objects do not have inherent colors, and the light does not have colors either. The following video explains both points based on modern science.
- At 2.30 minutes, he says that the process by which the brain interprets the signals from the sensors at the back of the retina as ‘red’ is not understood by science. That is because ‘color perception’ does not occur in the brain.
- So, where does the ‘perception of blue, red, etc.’ come from?
2. Think deeply about this issue. Scientists do not know where the perception of the color (‘red’ or ‘blue’) comes from.
- The colors are all made up by the mind in a very complex process.
- In the same way, tastes, smells, pleasing music, and the pleasure of touch are all mind-made. They are all ‘saññā‘ made up by the mind (not in real time, but through a very complex process in which our bodies and the external world arise via Paṭicca Samuppāda). P.S. See “Paṭicca Samuppāda Creates the External World, Too!“
3. I posted a version of this in another comment with more details. It is my comment on November 11, 2025, at 8:33 am (my last comment on that thread as of today): Post on ‘Colors Are Mind-Made (Due to Kāma Saññā)’
- I do not understand why people are having such a hard time understanding this.
- Just think about a single issue. Where do colors come from? Objects do not have inherent colors, and neither does light, which is electromagnetic radiation or just energy. As the above video explains, modern science has confirmed that. P.S. But being materialists who don’t believe in rebirth, they don’t care if the ‘pleasure sensation’ is created in the brain (as they believe); for them, the goal is to enjoy life while it lasts. However, it matters immensely if rebirth is real; one will be trapped in the ‘kāma loka‘ (including the apāyās) as long as one craves those so-called ‘pleasures.’
- In the same way, tastes, smells, etc., are not real either. But we attach to things in the world solely on the basis of those characteristics.
- That is why the Buddha said that attaching to those things is of ‘anicca nature’ (because they cannot provide long-lasting happiness; those ‘pleasures’ are brief and unsatisfying). Furthermore, our actions seeking such ‘pleasures’ only lead to rebirths in the apāyās. See “Fooled by Distorted Saññā (Sañjānāti) – Origin of Attachment (Taṇhā).”
- We will never be satisfied, even when we get to enjoy all those colorful, tasty things. There are many millionaires/billionaires in the world who can afford any of those things. Are they satisfied with life? Some even commit suicide! In any case, they also get old, suffer the old age issues, and die.
4. Based on the above, I tried to explain how one can get to the Sotapanna stage.
- The following are a few of the relevant posts: Sotapanna Anugāmi and Anicca/Viparināmi Nature of a Defiled Mind, Colors Are Mind-Made (Due to Kāma Saññā), What Does “Paccayā” Mean in Paṭicca Samuppāda?
- I hope at least a few people will start comprehending what I have been trying to explain over the past two to three years.
- Of course, it takes a determined effort to understand these deep concepts.
- Our human existence is the best opportunity we have. Those in the apāyās (including animals) cannot comprehend these issues. Those in the Deva and Brahma realms do not experience or see suffering, and so are not motivated to contemplate the ‘anicca nature.’ Even the rich and healthy among us cannot be motivated! They are too busy enjoying life (not realizing that it is a magic show in a grand scale)!
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A Habit is formed by repeated actions that strengthen it. Until you see the bad consequences of a habit, you cannot break it.
- Once you comprehend the dangers of sticking to a specific habit, you can break it with determination.
- In a nutshell, that’s how you break a habit.
- A habit is formed not strictly due to vipaka (if that were the case, you would not be able to break it). Habits are induced mostly by environmental factors. For example, many young people develop the habit of drinking due to the association with bad friends.
The Thero may have explained the correct concepts in the discourse. It is not possible to capture the essence of a discourse by listening to a sentence or two. I have not listened to the whole discourse, so I cannot say anything specific.
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