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1. Do you care about suffering?
- The Bodhisatta strived to find and stop the root causes of suffering. He did not investigate whether a “self” or “me” exists in reality.
- His investigations led to attaining Buddhahood. That is when he discovered the actual reality of existence, i.e., the fact that there is no “me” in ultimate reality is a byproduct of solving the root causes of suffering.
- The Buddha emphasized that he teaches the following: “In the past, as today, what I describe is suffering and the cessation of suffering.” See “Alagaddūpama Sutta (MN 22).”
- Similar statements are in several suttās. See, for example, “Titthāyatana Sutta (AN 3.61).”
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2. There is another critical point.
- One should not focus on whether a “self” or “me” exists in ultimate reality (especially at the beginning).
- Focusing on that can lead to stress and even mental issues. We have discussed one such case recently in this forum.
- Only at or above the Anāgāmi stage will one realize the truth of that ultimate reality.
3. This is why I stated the sequence of handling diṭṭhi, taṇhā, and māna (issue of a “me”) in that order. To quote from yesterday’s post, “Etaṁ mama, esohamasmi, eso me attā’ti – Connection to Taṇhā, Māna, Diṭṭhi“:
“14. Thus, attachment to sensory inputs occurs with taṇhā, māna, and diṭṭhi.
- The latter (diṭṭhi) is specifically sakkāya diṭṭhi. One first removes sakkāya diṭṭhi (and the associated vicikicchā and silabbata parāmāsa) at the Sotapanna stage.
- Taṇhā manifests as kāma rāga, rupa rāga, and arupa rāga. Kāma rāga (tendency to attach to sensual pleasures and associated paṭigha) is removed at the Anāgāmi stage. Rupa rāga (craving jhānic pleasures) and arupa rāga (craving arupa samāpatti pleasures) are removed at the Arahant stage.
- Removal of kāma rāga and paṭigha stops rebirths in kāma loka. Removal of rupa rāga and arupa rāga also stops rebirths in rupa and arupa loka, respectively; those “jhānic/samāpatti pleasures” are also mind-made.
- Finally, māna (sense of “me”) is also removed at the Arahant stage.“
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1. Thank you for summarizing the passages in my previous posts. It will help me revise them as needed.
- Also, you wrote: “<br />” I’ve tried several times to delete it, but it doesn’t work. So I’ll just leave it as is.”
- Sorry about that. It is a bug with the forum software. I have corrected them above. In the future, just leave them; I can easily correct them.
2. The following is the correct statement (which you quoted first):
- “There is a widespread belief that Buddha Gotama’s Buddha Sāsana will last 5000 years. However, I have not seen it in the Tipiṭaka. It could be in a later Commentary, but I have not seen such a commentary either.”
- Let me provide some evidence from the Tipiṭaka to confirm it.
3. The “Gotami Sutta (AN 8.51)” has the following verse (I have linked to that verse): “Sace, ānanda, nālabhissa mātugāmo tathāgatappavedite dhammavinaye agārasmā anagāriyaṃ pabbajjaṃ, ciraṭṭhitikaṃ, ānanda, brahmacariyaṃ abhavissa, vassasahassameva saddhammo tiṭṭheyya. Yato ca kho, ānanda, mātugāmo tathāgatappavedite dhammavinaye agārasmā anagāriyaṃ pabbajito, na dāni, ānanda, brahmacariyaṃ ciraṭṭhitikaṃ bhavissati. Pañceva dāni, ānanda, vassasatāni saddhammo ṭhassati.”
Translated: “But, Ānanda, if women had not obtained permission to bear the robes, the Buddha Sasana would have lasted 1,000 years. But now that I have given them permission, the Sasana will last only 500 years.”- However, at least one sutta says that as long as true Dhamma does not disappear, people will be able to attain Nibbana as long as there are living Sotapannas (or above) who can teach others. That is discussed below.
4. The Buddha emphasized that his teachings (among humans) will not disappear as long as there are at least Sotapannas among humans who can keep passing down the teachings to the next generation.
- That is in the “Mahāparinibbāna Sutta (DN 16)”: “Yasmiṁ kho, subhadda, dhammavinaye ariyo aṭṭhaṅgiko maggo na upalabbhati, samaṇopi tattha na upalabbhati. Dutiyopi tattha samaṇo na upalabbhati. Tatiyopi tattha samaṇo na upalabbhati. Catutthopi tattha samaṇo na upalabbhati. Yasmiñca kho, subhadda, dhammavinaye ariyo aṭṭhaṅgiko maggo upalabbhati, samaṇopi tattha upalabbhati, dutiyopi tattha samaṇo upalabbhati, tatiyopi tattha samaṇo upalabbhati, catutthopi tattha samaṇo upalabbhati. Imasmiṁ kho, subhadda, dhammavinaye ariyo aṭṭhaṅgiko maggo upalabbhati, idheva, subhadda, samaṇo, idha dutiyo samaṇo, idha tatiyo samaṇo, idha catuttho samaṇo, suññā parappavādā samaṇebhi aññehi. –Ime ca, subhadda, bhikkhū sammā vihareyyuṁ, asuñño loko arahantehi assāti.”
That means: “Subhadda, in whatever teaching and training the noble eightfold path is not found, there is no true Sotapanna, Sakadāgāmi, Anāgāmi, or Arahant. In whatever teaching and training the noble eightfold path is found, there is a true Sotapanna, a Sakadāgāmi, an Anāgāmi, and an Arahant. The noble eightfold path is found in this teaching (Buddha Dhamma) and training (Vinaya).
– As long as bhikkhus maintain the Ariya lineage, this world will have Arahants.”
5. I have extracted #3 and #4 above from the post, “Four Conditions for Attaining Sōtapanna Magga/Phala.” Those are #12 and #13 in that post.
- That post provides a complete explanation.
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1. You wrote: “The main goal is to maintain a state of equanimity.”
- I have no issue with that. I believe many people attending Goenka retreats attain a “state of equanimity.”
- One can attain a “state of equanimity” by focusing the mind on a fixed object, such as the breath or a ball of clay. That is not hard.
2. I (and several others) tried to explain that achieving a “state of equanimity” is not the goal of the Buddha Dhamma. Of course, it helps to achieve a “state of equanimity” to engage in insight meditation.
- To understand the goal of the Buddha Dhamma, one must believe in the following: (i) There is a rebirth process, (ii) most rebirths are in “suffering-filled realms,” (iii) the rebirth process cannot be stopped until the “sansāric bonds” (bonds to the rebirth process) are broken by cultivating Satipaṭṭhāna.
- Therefore, until the four states of magga phala (Sotapanna, Sakadagami, Anagami, Arahant) are attained, one would not be free of future suffering.
- Do they teach how to cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna? If so, please outline what is taught regarding Satipaṭṭhāna.
3. The worst suffering in the lowest realms would be stopped by reaching the Sotapanna stage. One must at least see the anicca nature to be a Sotapanna.
- You wrote: “The teaching is to see the anicca nature in every moment.”
- Can you explain what you understood by that statement? The anicca nature of what specifically?
See #9 through #12 in “Nirōdha Samāpatti, Phala Samāpatti, Jhāna, and Jhāna Samāpatti.”
I asked Grok (AI): “How has the number of children seeking ‘gender change’ changed over the years? I am interested in the long-term trend.”
Answer:
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1980s: ~100–200 global referrals/year.
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1990s: ~200–500 global referrals/year.
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2000s: ~500–1,500 global referrals/year.
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2010: ~1,500–2,000 global referrals; ~700–1,000 U.S. diagnoses.
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2013: ~2,000–3,000 U.S. diagnoses; ~1,000 UK referrals.
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2021: ~42,000 U.S. diagnoses; ~10,000 UK cases.
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2023: ~13,994 U.S. minors treated (2019–2023 cumulative).
The trend shows an exponential increase starting around 2010, with a particularly sharp rise post-2013, driven by adolescent females and broader access to care.________I am not sure how accurate the data is. But the trend is clear.You wrote: “He says that in reality there are only 4 jhānas (rupa jhānas) and what we call “arupa jhānas” are actually states within the 4th jhāna.”
- What I highlighted above is what is wrong.
Yes. There are only four jhānās, which correspond to the mental states of rupa loka Brahmas.
- There are four arupa samāpattis, which correspond to the mental states of arupa loka Brahmas.
- So, it is incorrect to say the following (to quote from your comment), “He says that in reality there are only 4 jhānas (rupa jhānas) and what we call “arupa jhānas” are actually states within the 4th jhāna.”
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The eight states you quoted from the Tapussa Sutta confirm what I mentioned above.
- The ninth one at the end of your comment is not a jhāna or samāpatti.
- “The cessation of perception and feeling“ is “nirodha samāpatti,” which is attainable only by an Arahant.
Also, see “Tapussa Sutta (AN 9.41)– Akuppā Cētōvimutti” and “Nirōdha Samāpatti, Phala Samāpatti, Jhāna, and Jhāna Samāpatti.”
Yes. But the critical point is that the phenomenon of sex change during a life is extremely rare.
- Only a couple of cases are mentioned in the Tipitaka, and those are due to extreme acts of immoral deeds.
- For example, one case is a wealthy person who saw an Arahant bathing; that male Arahant had an extremely appealing body. The rich person generated sexual feelings about the Arahant and was instantly transformed into a woman.
- The problem today is that children are taught that they can become a male or a female if they feel so. This has led to attempts at “forced sex changes” (not only with drugs but also surgeries), leading to many physical and psychological issues. A dangerous situation!
- One is born a male or female according to the gati one has cultivated in previous lives. We should not interfere with such natural processes with drugs or surgeries. However, in “borderline cases” (some may have overlapping “male gati” and “female gati“), we must be compassionate to accommodate them with necessary medical care (probably hormone therapy). But it is a small fraction. See the post “Sexual Orientation – Effects of Kamma and Gati (Saṅkhāra).”
- By the way, some are born without any sex organs (extremely rare). Those are kamma vipāka.
- I know that this is a politically charged issue. So, I would rather not discuss it further. It could be a distraction. Each person can make their conclusions. I am only pointing out conclusions based on my understanding of Buddha’s teachings.
I should have written my comment a bit differently. Let me rewrite it:
It means something like a counterpart, but does not imply ‘supplement’ (it means the opposite or in the other direction). It also does not mean the counterpart must be ‘the exact same amount.’
I think the issue here is the interpretation of paṭibhāgo.
- It means the counterpart, but does not imply “supplement” (it means the opposite or in the other direction). It also does not mean the counterpart must be “the exact same amount.”
Zapper asked, “Does that mean that even an arahant feels pain, and if so, is it only from the body sense organ?”
1. As Christian pointed out, there are many accounts in the Tipitaka about Arahants feeling bodily pain. Even the Buddha felt pain when a stone injured his foot (when Devadatta tried to take his life). He also felt bodily aches. In the final days, he had stomach pains.
- So, yes. There is plenty of evidence that Arahants feel “bodily pain.” In the same way, they can feel “bodily pleasures” like resting on a soft bed compared to sleeping on the ground.
2. The other types of “vedanā” are associated with “saññā” built into the physical body.
- For example, the sweet taste of sugar is a different type of “vedanā” are associated with “saññā” built into the physical body. It does not come through the nerves in the physical body (as in #1), but come through the tongue (taste).
- In reality, that “saññā” of sweetness in sugar is not real in an absolute sense. If it were, all living beings would taste sugar to be sweet. But a cow or a tiger would not eat sugar. In the same way, cows like to eat grass, but humans or tigers do not. That is why it is called “distorted saññā.”
- A puthujjana attaches to the taste of sugar. But since an Arahant has understood how the human bodies are built to provide a “sweet taste” (but the body of a tiger or cow is not), their minds do not go through the “automatic attachment” at the purāna kamma stage (at the very beginning of the tasting sugar).
- That is the critical point I tried to point out (as in your above quote: “and in the “Saññā Nidānā hi Papañca Saṅkhā – Immoral Thoughts Based on ‘Distorted Saññā’ post, you said “The key point is that their minds do not even go through the purāna kamma stage”).
3. Such “distorted saññā” can lead to a feeling of joy (or revulsion) with other senses, too. For example, we smell rotten meat to be repulsive, but a pig likes that smell.
- An Arahant would smell rotten meat as a “bad smell,” but is not depressed. They fully understand that smell is “made up.”
- The fact that Arahants also experience those “made-up emotions” (“agreeable and disagreeable”) associated with the sense faculties is expressed in the “Nibbānadhātu Sutta (Iti 44)“: “Their five sense faculties still remain. So long as their senses have not gone they continue to experience the agreeable and disagreeable, to feel pleasure and pain.”
- I have discussed that sutta in several posts: “Search Results for: Nibbānadhātu.” You can read them to gain further understanding of this critical point.
4. The difficulty lies in understanding how our bodies (and the external world) arise to provide that “distorted saññā.“
- It is fully explained via Paṭicca Samuppāda. The first few posts in the “Worldview of the Buddha” section explain that.
1. There are two types of asura, one being “asura deva” (who go into wars with Tavatimsa Devās) and the other “vipnipātika asura,” who belong to the apāyās.
- “Vipnipātika” means apāyās, or the four lowest realms. All realms in the apāyās can be called “vipnipātika.” Thus, “vipnipātika asura” is a category within the apāyās; they are born there because they were lazy as humans and cultivated asura saṅkhāra (for example, those who don’t like to work and depend on welfare even if they can work). That leads to asura viññāna and thus gives rise to an asura existence belonging to the apāyās. I have seen in the Commentaries that they can be born to be trapped inside mountains; they cannot move. However, I have not seen such descriptions in the suttās.
- See #13 of “Sīla, Samādhi, Paññā to Paññā, Sīla, Samādhi.”
2. Tavatimsa Devās are sometimes called “sura Devās” in comparison to “asura Devās“, and the war between the two sides is sometimes called the “sura asura war”.
- “Sura”, of course, is the opposite of “asura“: clever and “quick thinking”.
3. The “Gati Sutta (AN 9.68)” lists five main categories: hell (niraya), the animal realm (tiracchāna), the hungry ghost realm (peta), humans (manussa), and Deva.
- Of course, there are numerous subcategories within each of the five main categories.
- That is evident among animals; some are vicious, and others are harmless. Even among humans, there is a broad spectrum of gati (i.e., character/habits); see, for example, “The Law of Attraction, Habits, Character (Gati), and Cravings (Āsavas)“ and “9. Key to Ānāpānasati – How to Change Habits and Character (Gati).”
- Therefore, “vipnipātika asura” and “asura Deva” seem to be two minor categories within the apāyās and Deva realms.
There are two types of asurās. One is a type of Deva, and the other belongs to the apāyās.
- I will take a look at the suttās you quoted and make some comments later.
This is a subtle point. Those vedanā that arise in an Arahant are a manifestation of “distorted saññā.”
- An Arahant does not experience a “pure mind” while living daily life. His/her physical body formed at birth, before attaining Arahanthood. The “distorted saññā” (note that it is not defiled, i.e., does not have rāga, dosa, or moha) arises in anyone born with a physical body.
- However, when Arahants are in “Arahant-phala samāpatti” (where they experience the pure mind realized at the Arahant-phala moment), they do not experience the “distorted saññā.” While in that samāpatti, they do not experience vedanā associated with the “distorted saññā.”
- See #7 and #8 of “Saññā Nidānā hi Papañca Saṅkhā – Immoral Thoughts Based on ‘Distorted Saññā’” for details.
