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  • in reply to: Thilakkhana I #14517
    y not
    Participant

    Tobias!!

    I cannot highlight any sentence or phrase there, for the whole of what you say is perfect insight perfectly stated.

    No other comment is necessary from me.

    y not

    in reply to: Quick Kamma Vipāka & Dangers of Sense Pleasures #14516
    y not
    Participant

    Johnny:

    True. Except in the case where one has reached this state:

    Once a sitting Indian ascetic was confronted by a warrior wielding a drawn sword, shouting: do you realise that in front of you stands a man who can kill you without the blink of an eye ? Without moving a muscle he replied: do you realise that in front of you sits a man who is ready to die without the blink of an eye?

    Or, how far must we have travelled to have come to that stage?

    y not

    in reply to: Quick Kamma Vipāka & Dangers of Sense Pleasures #14511
    y not
    Participant

    Hello All:

    It is hard to see the adverse long-term outcome of sense pleasures in this gross material world alone (not considering the finer worlds for the moment,as that requires the belief in those worlds as a precondition). Most do not try at all, the general attitude being: ‘here is this moment, let me enjoy, after all we only live once. And if things turn out wrong, then I will have another throw of the dice, either in the same or in another direction. As long as there is life, there is hope’.

    Johnny said: ‘if they did not cause you any adverse effects, would you continue to enjoy them without considering the implications?’ Most people do. Those who see the dangers must have either great intelligence or have experienced the resulting suffering in previous lives, and this last, as I see, could really be the very root of that ‘intelligence’. This may not penetrate to the conscious level in most cases.

    This would be even more the case if one gets to consider the conditions in higher kama loka realms. Johnny said: ‘Which implies if we are going to exist in kama loka again to enjoy sense pleasures, we would need to take rebirth, grow old, fall sick, and die.’ But as one is free from sickness and old age in the realms of kama loka above the human, the temptation to enjoy there is even greater: a fine material body, heightened sense pleasures, no pains, no aches, no deseases, no old age….and for over 9 billion years (realm 11)..Wow!! ” Truly I think those who have reached the Sakadagami stage (here; there it will be difficult) can get a glimse of the real dangers there; an anagami anugami would see it. This is what I can make out.

    Our difficulty lies in that we can conceive of no blissful state apart from that arising from sense pleasures. I remember when I was about nine or ten years old observing that there was joy in my uncle’s house following the birth of a baby; some time back another uncle had died in Australia. I saw all around that in this world there is both the pleasant and the unpleasant, joy and grief; one follows the other and the other way around. Not only that, the same people who are happy now will be unhappy tomorrow and vice-versa. So, dissatisfied with this state of affairs, with having entered into such a world, knowing that I will be subject to it myself later in life, I said to myself: what if a Being, with the power to deliver, were to give me this choice: ‘Alright, you either suffer the same fate yourself (as is normal with everyone else) or you will never experience anything unpleasant in your life , but for that the price you have to pay will be never experiencing anything pleasant either’ Meaning, either both or neither. Life as you see it or death.I could not answer, because though I did not want all this unpleasantness, I did want the pleasant, and how! No almighty Being is necessary to tell you that there is no one-sided coin anywhere in this world. But that is what we keep hoping for and keep striving hopelessly for.

    Then we at last see that there is IN FACT a one-sided coin somewhere, there is indeed the Perfect State – but not in this world. If it were otherwise then all living would be just a long futile endeavour and a cruel one too. I can do no better than quote:
    If you lay bound upon the wheel of change
    and no way were of breaking from the chain
    The Heart of Boundless Being is a curse
    The Soul of Things fell Pain. You are not bound!

    So we strive on -BUT NOW IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

    y not

    in reply to: Thilakkhana I #14467
    y not
    Participant

    Embodied:

    Thanks.

    Yes, granted that ‘Not all (nowadays there are alot of different schools of thought) western psychologies / psychanalysis (both are Science too…) are incompatible with our Path.’ – but I grew up in the sixties and at that time it was still petty much ‘negative’, not to say condemning. If you liked being alone, then you needed treatment. And someone wrote something (I cannot recall who) to the effect that the first impression of something leaves an almost indelible effect which makes it impermeable to the influence of later developments. These are not the exact words, but I am sure you get it.

    So I am wrong in actul fact about my assessment of Western pschology at present. What I said was from my own experience of it.

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    in reply to: Thilakkhana I #14431
    y not
    Participant

    Embodied:

    “…Expectation, craving and attachment, can but be a source insatisfaction / frustation (DUKKHA…
    …sooner or later such image (sankata) of ourselves , mainly inspired on body/senses identification (another sankata) will be seriously shaken.”

    And then?

    And then you find that the world works against whoever tries to go into this. Friends and relatives at once give you the ‘snap out of it. Don’t worry, be happy ‘ advice (out of sincere compassion, no doubt) and urge you on with classic cliche’s like ‘ perhaps next time, as long as there is life there is hope, if you fail try and try again’ and similar distractions. You are hardly allowed to go into it.

    Western psychology does not help either; in fact I see it as the greatest hurdle to surmount. Directing the attention inward as in retrospection and reflection is termed introversion, a ‘condition’ bordering on mental disorder. One must be outgoing, extrovert, positive.

    It is not easy to see that ALL craving eventually leads to disappointment and delusion and for that one must go deep, and deeper still to see it even in future lives, especially in the so-termed ‘states of felicity’, and will be IMPOSSIBLE to see by seeking refuge in entertainment and partying. Once I overheard an English girl saying to a friend who had been moaning about her problems with her boyfriend: ‘Oh, get drunk’ !! I see no soultion, so drown the problem in alcohol. But the problem will be there next morning, and accompanied by a hangover as well.

    But we know there there is a State Of Being where one is free of all this, which IS the solution. For that we have striven and strive on, helped on by those who have made it their DUTY, no less, to assist others upon the Path leading to it.

    y not

    y not
    Participant

    Embodied:

    Travelled a road, yes, and for much too long; for since that Road is without beginning, it can only be toooooo long.

    As to the knowledge (not so much the use) of Pali, I used to think much as you do,but I have come to see its value. Many words have multiple meanings (to say nothing of those translated wrongly) and we, or I for one, would not have found those out by ourselves, or only partly so, but then with great difficulty, if at all.

    I see what you mean and I agree that if the knowledge of Pali were a prerequisite, then all those on the Way would come from the Indian sub-continent – and the Path cannot have such race and geographical restrictions. Moreover, he who has made himself ready to grasp in now has been preparing himself for many many lives, in which he could have been of any race, culture or location. That is why I tried to ‘simplify’ the Pali terms and apply them to English, as far as I am able to, of course. And that is only MY understanding.

    So I will be ever grateful to Lal here; besides the learning, I have had to UN-learn some things as well.

    y not

    in reply to: Do Arahants Dream? #14419
    y not
    Participant

    Hello Lal:

    …”One must stop fantasizing as soon as one becomes aware of it; that is part of Satipatthana”

    I have been working on this for years. I should have said:
    ‘And by dreaming HE meant both dreaming at night during sleep and
    dreaming in the waking state, fantasizing etc.’ , the point he wanted to get across being that on Enlightenment illusion stops in both states. I can say nothing about this ,in either case. Only, it is clear that we can address only those thought activities done consciously, as you point out.

    Thank you

    y not

    in reply to: Do Arahants Dream? #14405
    y not
    Participant

    Hi Johnny-Lim:

    …and I wonder whether you got this idea by yourself!!

    It had never occured to me until I read about it in a book by
    a ‘modern master’…who says that ‘on Enlightenment all dreams stop’
    And by dreaming is meant both dreaming at night during sleep and
    dreaming in the waking state, fantasizing etc.

    y not

    y not
    Participant

    Embodied:

    My post (March 9th) attempts to convey my ideas in ‘western’ terms, using the pali words only to connect those ideas with.

    HOWEVER, I had not read Lal’s post written 2 hrs or so before mine, which is more comprehensive. I missed the ‘1. Cultivates Anapana (Satipatthana) where one forcefully rejects bad thoughts and cultivates good thoughts’ bit altogether’ in my own assessment, for instance.

    This is just to make it clear that I am in no way a teacher and do not pretend to be one on here. What I say are only my ideas, no more than that. I felt I should say this so as not to cause confusion in you, or worse, to deviate you from the Path.

    y not

    y not
    Participant

    “Embodied said: “The “sine qua non” condition for not getting attached to a single material thing is not to experience it at all,or is to experience it but without getting attached ?”

    Is it possible not to experience material things?

    You are in a material world, all around and about; your very body is made up of planet Earth. Out of its elements an ovum and a spermatozoa developed giving rise to an organism that you entered. Now without this experiencing (that nothing there can be kept to one’s satisfaction,the realization of their ultimate worthlessness and their repeated arising and destruction) without this delusion – another word, the ‘wordly’ word, for anicca- how could there in time arise the urge to strive to be free of it? A sense of unsatisfactoriness, dukkha,results – and can this dukkha be Utimate Existence,the Perfect State, Atta? This is just one progression,as I see, put in terms more comprehensible in the West.

    The solution, as Embodied hinted, is to experience, yes, but without getting attached. But that is the hard bit. The very nature of everything we experience is the nature of that which we are made of – it will be the same in higher realms, finer and finer sense objects for finer and finer sense faculties for finer and finer ‘physical’ bodies, so there is no escape there either. Whichever world we make ourselves fit for, that world we attain.

    But all worlds are temporary AND anicca as well. To go beyond all the worlds, beyond all becoming, to attain the Deathless, Nibbana which is Atta, everlasting perfection in all senses , sukkha and nicca. You stop getting attached only when you see and experience time after time the hidden dukkha in all attachment. Then there is no way back possible.

    So the field of endeavour is anicca (and asubha).

    in reply to: Gandhabba and Cloning #14357
    y not
    Participant

    Lal:

    It is all in the post: why-are-tilakkhana-not-included-in-37-factors-of-enlightenment, but I had not read that.

    Thanks once again,

    y not

    in reply to: Gandhabba and Cloning #14349
    y not
    Participant

    Lal:

    ..’ All these concepts to Upanishads or Hindu Vedas ORIGINATED in the previous Buddha Sasana of the Kassapa Buddha, who was born before the Gotama Buddha’

    Ah, I see.

    And of course, by implication, the Teaching of Kassapa Buddha was in essence the same one as that of the Buddha before him, and so going back maha-kalpa before maha-kalpa to all the Buddhas in all the universes without beginning – for the Teaching can only be one and the same throughout all time. Reality does not change, so neither can the Teaching.

    Thank you

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    in reply to: Gandhabba and Cloning #14346
    y not
    Participant

    Hello Lal:

    Thanks for the post.

    As far as the gandhabba/cloning query is concerned, I myself had no questions about it at all.

    Of relevance to the point I made is:
    15. The main point from Buddha Dhamma is that a new life cannot be created by any means,…
    All living beings in existence now have been in the rebirth process forever.
    Living beings just keep switching from realm to realm…

    …..all of which tallies with what I had at once perceived to be true
    when coming across these notions in the Upanishads. There is is said: sadbhavena sarvam ajam (no need for me to translate that for you) and that is said to be the highest truth, i.e that everything is without origination, there is only a never-ending changing of forms. There is therefore not even a ‘Causeless Cause’ out of which everything arises, be it designated as Being, Be-ness, Alayavijnana, Existence, Nothingness, Sunnyata,the Plenum-Void…tena na asti vai ucchedah, therefore, again from the standpoint of the highest Reality, there can be no destruction, no ceasaing-to-be for that which ever IS.

    So, as I see, Buddhadhamma fits perfectly with the tenets of the Upanishads. Correct me if I am wrong there. The basic statement about Paticcasamuppada is also found in the Mandukya (the Karika, or commentary therein ,to be precise, of Gaudapada):
    yavat hetuphalavesah, tavat hetuphalodhavah (tavat samsarah ayatah)
    hetuphalavese ksine, na asti hetuphalodhavah (na prapadyate samsaram)

    Of course, this says nothing of kamma beeja created in the timeless past which could also translate into future lives and future suffering- It only says ‘how can there be effects if there are no causes? So stop creating causes, stop seeing or hoping for the result of your actions, disassiciate any idea of effect or reward, and there will be no effects’
    But Buddhadhamma shows that there ARE causes present already, even if we do not create more.

    y not

    in reply to: anicca, collective understanding of mankind? #14334
    y not
    Participant

    Hi Sybe!

    I just came across your posts.

    The thing is normal people do have the anicca sanna in the various ways that you mention, yes, but they stop there. This may lead to hopelessness and even depression. But the anicca sanna is only a part of the cure.

    If you read AN 7.49 :
    Sattimā, bhikkhave, saññā bhāvitā bahulīkatā mahapphalā honti mahānisaṃsā amatogadhā amata­pari­yosānā. Katamā satta? Asubhasaññā, maraṇasaññā, āhāre paṭikūlasaññā, sabbaloke anabhi­rata­saññā, aniccasaññā, anicce dukkhasaññā, dukkhe anattasaññā……I am not copying the English translation because some terms are not renedered correctly.

    The seven perceptions are given and linked together starting with that of Asubha -unfruitfullness (the translation gives that as unattractiveness, implying the sense of sight mainly) then on to death, food,’all the worlds’then anicca, followed by ANICCE DUKKHA and
    DUKKHE ANATTA. That is, the Buddha showed that when the perception of anicca arises, that perception should be GONE INTO not just fleetingly, which brings one to see the Dukkha in it, and go into that, then from the perception of Dukkha , DUKKHE ANATTA follows, that is , one sees that DUKKHA is ANATTA, or that the perception of ANATTA follows from DUKKHA. That is why, at the very start, the seven perceptions are not only developed but PURSUED, they have a great effect and bring great reward…and they lead ‘into’ the DEATHLESS(as the path or ground) and TO the DEATHLESS (as the final goal) ,that is NIBBANA. How more positive can it be?

    Moreover, when one sees Anatta in everything, one then sees that Ultimate Reality cannot be that, it can only be ATTA -which is Sukkha and Nicca. You take the right road only when you have seen the wrong one for what it is.

    Lal has got it all condensed in half a sentence and one: …’even though just getting a glimpse of it makes one’s mind joyful. One can see that there is a Path to happiness (via getting rid of suffering)’

    y not

    in reply to: Body, Gandhabba & vice-versa #14315
    y not
    Participant

    Lal:

    Thank you for the elucidation, albeit that being to only a degree (as yet).

    It is a complex matter and you have time limitations. All the more I feel I should thank you for all your efforts.

    I still have the more important matter of listening to that fifth discourse,for which I have not yet found the proper moment.

    y not

Viewing 15 posts - 541 through 555 (of 581 total)