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I’ve read a few topics here where others shared their personal struggles. I’d get curious because I could relate and would look forward to the answers to get some ideas on how to resolve the situation. Ideal situation would be if we could truly help each individual for their unique situation, a solution customized just for them, a practical solution. Unfortunately that can’t always be done, especially over the internet. So the next best we could do is give advise that we think could most likely help. One of the common answers given for peoples struggles is: cultivating metta. And I know if this is suggested, to many it will probably seem like a broken record or meaningless, or think “this is not gonna be of much practical help.” I know that in my case, whenever I read “metta bhavana” as the answer, I acknowledged that advise and nodded in agreement in my mind, but in reality it went through one ear and out the other. I did not truly take it to heart.
My metta bhavana for the longest time has been a fail and waste of time. I’d have a long list of good wills that I’d wish for all sentient beings. I’d try to say them everyday. But I’d skip a lot of days. I did not stick to it. Even when I did recite the good wills, I said the majority of them with no feeling. There truly was no metta nor karuna in my mind when I recited those. They were empty, meaningless words. Out of all the good wills, I noticed one of them induced a deep noticable feeling within me- when I wished that all would become Sotapanna. I wondered why out of all of them , only this one would consistently evoke an emotion within me. Gave me goosebumps. I felt karuna rise in my mind. I considered this the only successful moment in my entire metta bhavana. I thought if only the rest of the good wills induced the same feeling.
I think the reason wishing the Sotapanna stage for others had more impact on me than the other wishes is because the Sotapanna stage had many important implications: never being reborn in apayas, the worst types of suffering completely eliminated, destined for Paribbana-the ending of all suffering.
While both metta and karuna are similar, they are different. Metta is wanting happiness for others, karuna is wanting the easing/ending of others’ suffering.
While both are good, I feel I can more easily induce karuna within me rather than metta. For example, if I saw two scenarios:
1) A parent giving their child a birthday present
2) Someone giving food to a homeless person2 would make me more happy.
I feel more happy easing other suffering rather than giving them things that might make them temporarily happy like watch/dress.
So I decided to instead focus on karuna rather than metta. Focus on the suffering of others. Because I noticed this is what triggers/awakens/induces my karuna cetasika, or the sleeping compassion within my mind.
Staying away from dasa akusala is necessary and praise worthy. However it is not everything. This will not be enough to get closer to Sotapanna stage. One can’t simply just stay away from immorality. They have to cultivate good qualities within their minds as well. Anapana: Discard the bad qualities/asobhana cetasika. Cultivate the good qualities/sobhana cetasika. Like removing weeds from someones garden in addition to planting the fruit seeds. One needs to do both. I’ve been doing the “apana” in anapana quite right this time(staying away from dasa akusala, weakening bad qualities), but not doing the “ana” much(cultivating good qualities like karuna).
Some event happened last fall which gave me a sense of urgency. Like there is not much time left. I could go anytime. So I thought that if that time might be coming soon, I need my mind to be in a good state. The most beautiful states of mind one can have is metta/karuna. So I thought I can’t neglect/slack off on cultivating metta/karuna anymore.
Siebe wrote:
“In the end there are no bad or evil and good persons, only ignorant and wise persons.”I don’t know why I missed this yesterday. Very well said! Couldn’t agree more! That is the great message that one can get from reading the background stories of the Dhammapada verses or other suttas.
So the following will be long. I apologize. It is for Siebe and others who are in similar situations. In case it could help you or anyone else, I thought I’d give more time/effort into describing on what helped me.
Siebe, in your posts you have hinted a few times your circumstances aren’t the best. I read them as a calling out for help. And now that I know that you suffer from something like PTSS, it makes sense. I’m so sorry you have to suffer this.
From this older forum topic: Painful and pleasant practice forum topic , you brought up the sutta on the 4 modes of practise. Where the difficulty and speed of one’s practise of the Path is listed.
1) Hard and slow
2) Hard but fast
3) Easy but slow
4) Easy and fastYou said you think that 1 probably applies to you. I probably belong to either 1 or 2. Kind of like hard mode in videogames. But regardless of which mode it is, no matter how hard it is, no matter how many times we fall or mess up(not being perfect in our sila), or how far away our moment of magga phala is, the main thing to do is to continue striving. If it is indeed hard mode, attaining magga phala will feel that much better.
I have no idea of exactly knowing what you’ve been through or what your daily struggles are like, and it would be wrong of me to do so. We really have no idea what others could be going through. But I can sort of relate to the phenomena of having harmless everyday insignificant sense inputs causing stress on one’s mind, in your case a loud slamming door, in my case silly things like hearing someone sneezing/picking or blowing their nose/or not washing their hands long enough in the bathroom is enough to ruin my day sometimes, to the point that it will become the recurrent topic I’ll keep thinking about for the rest of the day, come back when I’m trying to contemplate. Fearing that I’ll encounter more similar inputs, I lock myself in my room for most of the day so my mind does not max out on stress. This has been going on for the past 6 years and continuing.
On my practise, it has impacted me the following ways:
1) My momentary focus on everyday things was bad. Example: when wearing my socks, brushing my teeth, brushing my hair, opening fridge door, I would not focus on that task at hand, I’d do all these activities while thinking about numerous other topics, jumping from one topic to another.
2) Even formal breath meditation(which is recommended for those with ocd/anxiety disorders) is difficult. I can’t successfully focus on consecutive breaths.
3) My body is always clenched/tense, especially in abdomen area. As if always on flight or fight setting.
Thus tapa(heat/agitation of the mind) is quite high and recurrent for most of my day, especially when I leave my room or house.Hi Lal.
Here is the sutta that Johnny might be referring to.
Sutta SN 25.1 Cakkhusutta The Eye :
“Someone who has faith and confidence in these principles is called a follower by faith. They’ve arrived at inevitability regarding the right path, they’ve arrived at the level of the good person, and they’ve transcended the level of the bad person. They can’t do any deed which would make them be reborn in hell, the animal realm, or the ghost realm. They can’t die without realizing the fruit of stream-entry.Someone who accepts these principles after considering them with a degree of wisdom is called a follower of the teachings. They’ve arrived at inevitability regarding the right path, they’ve arrived at the level of the good person, and they’ve transcended the level of the bad person. They can’t do any deed which would make them be reborn in hell, the animal realm, or the ghost realm. They can’t die without realizing the fruit of stream-entry. Someone who understands and sees these principles is called a stream-enterer, not liable to be reborn in the underworld, bound for awakening.”
In Pali:
“Cakkhuṃ bhikkhave, aniccaṃ viparināmī1- aññathābhāvi, sotaṃ aniccaṃ viparināmī aññathābhāvī, ghānaṃ aniccaṃ viparināmī aññathābhāvī, jivhā aniccā viparināmī aññathābhāvī, kāyo anicco viparināmī aññathābhāvī, mano anicco viparināmī aññathābhāvī.
Yo bhikkhave, ime dhamme evaṃ saddahati adhivuccati, ayaṃ vuccati saddhānusārī okkanto sammattaniyāmaṃ sappurisabhumiṃ okkanto vītivatto puthujjanabhumiṃ, abhabbo taṃ kammaṃ kātuṃ yaṃ kammaṃ katvā nirayaṃ vā tiracchānayoniṃ vā pettivisayaṃ vā upapajjeyya. Abhabbo va2- tāva kālaṃ kātuṃ yāva na sotāpattiphalaṃ sacchikaroti.
Yassa kho bhikkhave, ime dhamme evaṃ paññāya mattaso nijjhānaṃ khamanti, ayaṃ vuccati dhammānusāri okkanto sammattaniyāmaṃ sappurisabhumiṃ okkanto vītivatto puthujjanabhumiṃ, abhabbo taṃ kammaṃ kātuṃ yaṃ kammaṃ katvā nirayaṃ vā tiracchānayoniṃ vā pettivisayaṃ vā upapajjeyya. Abhabbo va tāva kālaṃ kātuṃ yāva na sotāpattiphalaṃ sacchikaroti.
Yo bhikkhave, ime dhamme evaṃ jānāti3- evaṃ passati. Ayaṃ vuccati sotāpanno avinipātadhammo niyato sambodhiparāyanoti.”Hi Siebe.
You wrote:
” I know this is not a therapeutic forum and site, but it might lead to a better understanding and might be helpfull to others too. I think it shows the workings of the mind. ”Helping our fellow Dhamma friends in whatever little ways we can so that they can practise the Path with more ease rather than discomfort seems fitting for a Dhamma forum like this.
Siebe wrote:
“My own years of experience is that practising buddha-dhamma is very hard when such issues are not tackled first, because they colour the mind too much. ”Yes this very true. Practising the Path and Nibbana is indeed difficult without the 4 requisites(food, clothing, medicine, shelter), without a comfortable life. Physical diseases and mental disorders deprive one of a comfortable life, prevents people from practising the Path with ease. They have to try that much harder, put that much more energy/effort(viriya). Which can get exhausting at times.
I know you how you feel because I struggle with a mental disorder. I have severe ocd/germophobia, so severe to the point I don’t leave my house, and barely leave my room. This drains a lot of my energy. This is one of the reasons why it is difficult for me to concentrate during formal meditation.
Later when I find the time, I’d like to share how I handle it and what I’ve done recently that drastically improved my conditions/situation.
Questions:
1) Everything in this entire world is essentially energy (whether it is mano rupa or rupa rupa)?2) Everything is either mano rupa(below sudastaka) or rupa rupa(at/above sudastaka)?
3) Mano rupa is precursor. All rupa rupa started out as mano rupa before condensing to rupa rupa?
Another point I want emphasize is that anariyas should be able to have saddha.
There would appear to be 3 types of faith/devotion:
1) Blind
2) Temporary anariya saddha
3) Permanent unwavering Ariya saddha(I’d assume this is the avecca pasada)The overall/cumulative level of our sobhana vs asobhana cetasika can change from life to life. Can either increase or decrease. Can either get stronger or weaker. Depending on which cetasika we cultivate and which cetasika we neglect. Like habits. It can even change within this very life.
The asobhana cetasika are:
Lobha, dosa, moha, thina, middha, kukkucca, vicikicca, uddhacca, ditthi, mana, issa, ahirika, anotappa, maccariya.Some sobhana cetasika are:
Alobha, adosa, amoha, sati, saddha, hiri, ottappa, karuna, mudita, panna.An anariya’s lobha cetasika can decrease and his/her karuna cetasika can increase in this life. An example would be an anariya yogi who has cultivated jhana or an anariya brahma. Both are anariya, yet both would have low lobha, and high karuna. But since they are anariya, they have not locked in on those cetasika levels. These cetasika levels can be lost and change in future lives. Thus it is temporary.
Unlike that of an Ariya. An Ariya, let’s say Anagami, would also have no lobha and have high karuna like a brahma or yogi who cultivated jhana. Difference being, the Anagami has locked in on those cetasika levels. It is permanent. Those cetasika levels will not be lost nor change in future lives.
Lobha is a asobhana cetasika.
Karuna is a sobhana cetasika.If an anariya can decrease/increase lobha and karuna, then same can be done for saddha. If lobha and karuna levels can be temporary and change from life to life, same applies to saddha. Because, as listed from above, saddha is a sobhana cetasika.
Sotapanna Anugami are one of the 8 Ariyas and part of the 4 pairs of Ariyas. I was under the impression that all Ariyas would have avecca pasada.
Student wrote:
“Can anybody share any document which proves that Mahāyāna is a later branch?”To your question regarding Mahāyāna. In my opinion, I think the proof of it being a later branch is self-evident. One just needs to read the sutras. One red flag after another. Full of one contradiction and inconsistency after another. I think one could possibly write a book listing the contradictions/inconsistencies.
The sutras from Mahāyāna are in Sanskrit. The suttas from the Tipitaka are in Pali. The fact that the “sutras(not suttas)” are in Sanskrit and not in Pali alone, is a red flag. The Buddha did not give his discourses in Sanskrit. It was in Maghadhi. As Lal wrote in one of the posts: “Pāli is a version of Maghadhi suitable for writing down oral discourses in summary form suitable for transmission.”
From Preservation of the Buddha Dhamma :
“That is when the Buddha admonished them that Sanskrit was a language with musical overtones developed by the high-minded Brahmins and thus it was not possible to convey the true meanings of Maghadhi (Pali) words in Sanskrit; see, Chulavagga 5.33.”From Chulavagga 5.33 :
“You are not, O Bhikkhus, to put the word of the Buddhas into (Sanskrit) verse. Whosoever does so, shall be guilty of a dukkata. I allow you, O Bhikkhus, to learn the word of the Buddhas each in his own dialect.'”
To get more clarity on Mahāyāna, I think you will find the following post in particular, to be beneficial. If you have not read it already, I highly recommend it:
The Saddharma Pundarika Sutra (Lotus Sutra) – A Focused Analysis
Here’s one of the best highlights from that post, major clear as day/obvious contradiction/inconsistency:
“This sutrā starts off by the Buddha saying that even though he had taught that there were three paths to nibbāna but now he is admitting that there is only one; when Ven. Ananda asked why, he says that he did not think people were “ready” for this higher doctrine. Thus instead of there being three vehicles (or paths) one can take, there is only one which is the great vehicle or the Mahāyāna (“mahā” is great and “yāna” is vehicle). And this is the path that he himself took by striving for aeons as a Bodhisattva to become a Buddha.Continuing with this sutrā, now he (the Buddha) was advising everyone to become a Bodhisattava and to attain the Buddhahood. Then he assures all those Arahants present there, including Ven. Sariputta, that they themselves will become Buddhas. This is a complete lack of understanding of the concept of an Arahant (even though the sutta itself says that those Arahants had removed all defilements). An Arahant is not going to be reborn and thus there is no way for an Arahant to become a Buddha.”
Hi Student.
You wrote:
“This is an issue of mystery and dissatisfaction.”I have such similar questions myself, so I understand your curiosity.
Student wrote:
“why not the start.”Here is a sutta that might be of use to those on the Path, whenever these questions arise:
“Malunkyaputta, if anyone were to say, ‘I won’t live the holy life under the Blessed One as long as he does not declare to me that “The cosmos is eternal,”… or that “After death a Tathagata neither exists nor does not exist,”‘ the man would die and those things would still remain undeclared by the Tathagata.
“It’s just as if a man were wounded with an arrow thickly smeared with poison. His friends & companions, kinsmen & relatives would provide him with a surgeon, and the man would say, ‘I won’t have this arrow removed until I know whether the man who wounded me was a noble warrior, a brahman, a merchant, or a worker.’ He would say, ‘I won’t have this arrow removed until I know the given name & clan name of the man who wounded me… until I know whether he was tall, medium, or short… until I know whether he was dark, ruddy-brown, or golden-colored… until I know his home village, town, or city… until I know whether the bow with which I was wounded was a long bow or a crossbow… until I know whether the bowstring with which I was wounded was fiber, bamboo threads, sinew, hemp, or bark… until I know whether the shaft with which I was wounded was wild or cultivated… until I know whether the feathers of the shaft with which I was wounded were those of a vulture, a stork, a hawk, a peacock, or another bird… until I know whether the shaft with which I was wounded was bound with the sinew of an ox, a water buffalo, a langur, or a monkey.’ He would say, ‘I won’t have this arrow removed until I know whether the shaft with which I was wounded was that of a common arrow, a curved arrow, a barbed, a calf-toothed, or an oleander arrow.’ The man would die and those things would still remain unknown to him.”
Existing in sansara is like being shot with that poisoned arrow. The antidote is Nibbana.
In my opinion, if the Buddha never explicitly spoke about such topics, I think it is of not much benefit to ponder at long lengths about them. Because the only being I’d trust to get the full/correct answers to these questions is from the Buddha himself, the best source. So if he answered any of these questions, it would most likely be in the Tipitaka, that is our second best source now without the Buddha. Otherwise we can only speculate/guess/theorize, and never find the true definitive/satisfying answer.
Thank you so much for the encouragement and additional instructions Lal, really appreciate it!
Lal wrote:
“Regarding the #1 above, I would also suggest looking into whether any of the 10 types of miccha ditthi are left Micchā Ditthi, Gandhabba, and Sōtapanna Stage .”In 2016 before I got into Buddha Dhamma, I had 6 of the miccha ditthi, while only lacking 4 of the miccha ditthi. After I got into Buddha Dhamma that same year, the remaining 6 were eliminated as well. So at the very least, I do believe I am on the mundane Path.
firewns wrote:
“In my opinion, as your second goal, it should be having the chance to hear the pure Dhamma from Buddha Metteyya and to attain magga phala there and then, or even in the intervening years before He arrives in the human realm, which seems to be better than to be reborn as a Brahma being.”We think alike. That is another reason why I want to be reborn a brahma. If you see this topic from last month, this was my reply:
Sammaparibbajaniya Sutta forum topic
“2) If can’t attain stages of Nibbana, then attain jhana so that one can increase the chance of a brahma bhava and maybe become Ariya as a brahma. Billions years of bliss and safety from apayas. Since brahmas have long lifespan, this increases the chance of possibly meeting the future Buddha as well(yes this is my wish haha), and become an Ariya after listening to a desana by him. ”
firewns wrote:
“The power of making determinations when performing kusala and/or punna kamma can be tremendous.”Yes, could not agree more! Our repeated abhisankhara create an energy, that if done enough and with strong/potent enough intention, it creates momentum and propels a sentient being towards that direction(goal/wish/desire). Sometimes to the point that it is fated or becomes fate rather than have a weak chance/probablity of coming to fruition(in the case of Bodisatta and Chief disciples). That is why I have a daily routine, and list of wishes/determinations when doing kusala/punna/metta bhavana, to create and build up this energy so that it would propel me towards the Sotapanna stage at the very least.
Compared to the other sense pleasures, I can quite easily quit body pleasures and nose pleasures, cold turkey if need be. And now, I think I can do this for food as well, without missing it so much. But I can’t say the same for beautiful sights. And especially not for music. As you can see from the the second category, music is one of my strongest weaknesses. I do not think I will ever be able to quit it cold turkey. For this one, I feel I will let it run its course of reduction naturally. Yet still set limits of course so as not to cross the threshold of third precept boundaries.
If I do listen, the 3 compromises/limitations/restrictions I make is:
1) I set maximum limit of 6 songs in one day. Could be less than 6. But nothing more than 6.
2) that I won’t hum it throughout the rest of the day
3) That I try to stop the assada/vaci sankhara about it.But the thing is I am a bit worried listening to 6 songs maybe too much. So that is why I’d like to hear opinions from others. I’d appreciate all of your input. Does not matter if your opinions are not the same, not everybody will feel nor agree on everything. But I’m still interested in your advise. I’ll take all of it into account, to take the best course of action.
So for someone in my situation/with my cravings, what time-limit do you think I should set for music listening(5, 10, 20 minutes)?
My strategy:
Since there are 5 sense inputs, I personally will not tackle all of them at once. I feel this would end up failing. But instead target the easiest/least tempting ones first. Then eventually go for the hardest/most tempting ones.Rate the 5 sense input pleasures in two categories:
1) Tempting level from strongest to weakest:
-Ear for pleasing sounds/body for pleasing touches tied
-Eyes for pleasing sights
-Tongue for pleasing tastes
-Nose for pleasing scents2) From easiest to hardest to relinquish/quit/reduce/abstain from:
-Nose for pleasing scents
-Body for pleasing touches
-Tongue for pleasing tastes
-Eyes for pleasing sights
-Ear for pleasing soundsNow if one were to ask me just a few years ago about food, I would have said that it would have been one of the very last pleasures I could reduce the craving for. I was the biggest foodie my whole life, my childhood motto was “food is my pleasure.” That inner foodie is still there lurking inside of course. But in these past few months, especially recently, I noticed my cravings for it are not the same as before. Not as potent/strong as before. I feel a strong apparent decrease in my craving for food. I am content with bland food, just for sake of eating/sustenance and staying alive. I went from “live to eat” to “eat to live.” I personally think this is significant for someone who has been a foodie since childhood. I shared this to show that even laypeople, even anariya people who are not yogis, or have jhanic ability can also reduce cravings for something that is very tempting for them.
I know for the Path, if one’s kama raga is under control and tame, it is not necessary to force nor use will power for kama raga suppression, and that if one keeps following the Path it will naturally/automatically/gradually/eventually reduce in power. If one feels their kama raga is increasing and thus worsening towards kamachanda/lobha level, this is when force and will power are needed.
Having said that, I’m sure there is another camp whose kama raga is under control/tame but still wants to reduce it even further. Using force/will power is us using our viriya cetasika. Viriya is the energy/effort we put into activities including the Path. Viriya is also part of Satara Iddhipada. For the Path, it is Samma Vayama.
So the following is for those in that third camp who want to put Samma Vayama into practise in regards to reducing kama raga through will power(viriya).
Now obviously suppressing kama raga is no easy task. I feel it is the strongest asava of majority of sentient beings. One of the biggest obstacles in sansara. Greatest and strongest of temptations. It is our strongest hardwired habits.
Removing hardwired habits cannot be done all at once, just as an alcoholic would not cut off all alcohol cold turkey. That would cause withdrawal symptoms, and the person’s urges/cravings would only get stronger, and they would regress back to drinking alcohol. To make the transition a lasting habit, one should rather reduce the alcohol intake gradually, tapering off slowly/gradually so that they eventually stop drinking for good. So it becomes a new good hardwired habit that replaced the old bad hardwired habit.
So I feel the same technique could apply to reducing the cravings for the 5 sense inputs.
Everyone’s cravings and preferences for the 5 sense input pleasures are different. Not everyone will rate the pleasures the same way. Thus there really can’t be a one-size fits all strategy for all. But rather I feel it would be better if one could make a customised/tailor-made strategy for ourselves, each individual, that is suited to our personal preference/tastes due to each of our own unique gati/character/personality/cravings/desires.
