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Firewns asked: “You have mentioned before that it is meritorious to offer fruits and perhaps other food to devas, as the devas can manifest much more quantities of the food for their underlings. But what about the offering of flowers, incense and lights in certain East Asian countries? Can the scent of flowers and incense serve as food for devas as well? What about lights?”
I was going to write a post, but thought of just providing the key ideas first. In the end, it may be good idea to write a post after further discussion and inputs by others. I had written previously (at the discussion forum) about how offerings to devas are actually “consumed” by them, but I cannot find it. If someone finds it please post a link so that I don’t need to re-write that part in a future post.
1. The key point is that those “offerings” are not made just for devas.
– There are many kinds of offerings: meals to the bhikkhus are the most meritorious among the “giving” (dāna) category. Giving to poor or anyone in need and even feeding hungry animals are all meritorious deeds.
– Making offerings to devas is just another category. As you mentioned, I had discussed that before. The mechanism of how that works is hard to visualize for us. I don’t need to re-write that and if anyone remember that post, please provide a link. That would help me writing a post in the future.2. Offering flowers, incense, etc do not belong to that “dāna” category, even though many people make such “offerings” to devas, especially in Hindu temples.
– In Buddhist temples, such “offerings” are made to the Buddha.
– In reality, these “offerings of the second kind” setup the necessary background for the mind to grasp the Buddha Dhamma, and thus to lead to “bhava uddha” (stopping existences in any of the 31 realms), which is the real meaning of “Buddha”; see, “A Buddhist or a Bhauddhaya?“.3. For example, those flowers symbolize the anicca nature. They are pretty when they offered, but in a couple of days they become wrinkled and eventually wither away. The idea is not to admire the beauty of the flowers, but to contemplate on the anicca nature clearly displayed by the decay of those flowers.
– The incense offered emit an odor that conducive to mediation. Even though it is a pleasing odor, it is very different from those fragrances that one wears to a party, which has the tendency to encourage “seeking sense pleasures”.
– In other words, those fragrances worn to a party leads to sensual thoughts, whereas the smell of incenses is conducive to meditation, since it helps calm the mind.4. Lighting of candles of oil lamps also provide a suitable background for meditation and contemplation. Light symbolizes wisdom.
– Comprehending Buddha Dhamma leads to the opening of the “Dhamma eye”, and enables one to “see the true nature of the world of 31 realms”, i.e., existence in ANY of those realms is NOT devoid of suffering.
– Furthermore, an oil lamp symbolizes the how the rebirth process is maintained by cravings. Just as oil keeps an oil lamp burning, cravings (tanhā) fuel the rebirth process.5. When I was child in Sri Lanka, our family used to go to the temple regularly, especially on Full Moon days when bhikkhu would deliver a discourse (desana).
– We would go to the temple ahead the delivery of the desana, and would offer flowers to the Buddha, light some oil lamps and incense, and recite several gathas while make those “offerings”. Then we would sit and listen to an hour-long desana by a bhikkhu.
– That really helps calm the mind and get in to a mindset where one is able to forget about the day-to-day stresses and comprehend the desana.6. That is a brief introduction. This is a topic to be discussed in more detail. For example, some people question the practice of “worshipping” Bo trees, stupas, or statues of the Buddha.
– In reality, it is not “worship” or “pay homage” to inanimate objects. One is paying homage to the Buddha, and cultivating a calm mindset in order to grasp the deep Dhamma that the Buddha taught in order to get to the “bhava uddha” or Buddha state.
– Furthermore, those aspects have nothing to do with making offerings to devas.Thank you, firewns.
I need more rest than I used to. So, it may take some time to be “back to normal”. However, I participating in the forum discussions is not a problem.
Your question needs a long explanation. It may be better to write a post on that and it may take several days.
Yes. This is discussed in, “Amazingly Fast Time Evolution of a Thought (Citta)“. Especially see #12.
However, those memories are not stored in the brain, even though the brain is needed to “extract those memories”; see, “The Amazing Mind – Critical Role of Nāmagotta (Memories)“.
It seems that a couple of posts got deleted (including one by me) got deleted overnight.
If you are going to make a comment, please keep a copy, in case it gets deleted. We are trying to fix the problem.
The post in question is: “Pāli Dictionaries – Are They Reliable?”
In that post, in #1, it says: “Pāli does not have its own alphabet. It was a spoken language, and the Pāli Canon (Tipitaka) was first written using Sinhala alphabet around 5 BCE (two thousand years ago); see, “Historical Background“.”
So, the question appears to be: “Did the Sinhala alphabet exist 2000 years ago in the same form as today?”. It is an important question, and one can get some insights by looking into this issue.
The short answer is that the Sinhala alphabet very likely underwent CHANGES during those 2000 years.
The answer is in the post, “Preservation of the Buddha Dhamma“.
It would be better to read that whole post, but the answer to this question is under #9:“9. Another important point is that even up to the 20th century, the whole Tipitaka was written on specially prepared ola (palm) leaves. They deteriorate over 100 years or so and needed to be re-written. Even though that was a very labor-intensive process (there are about 60 large volumes in the modern printed version of the Tipitaka), it served another important purpose.
- Sinhala language (both spoken and written) changed over the past 2000 years. The need to re-write it every 100 or so years made sure that the changes in Sinhala script was taken into account; of course Pāli language has not changed at all”.
Therefore, any changes to words/alphabet would have been taken care of due to this process.
I need to revise the post “Pāli Dictionaries – Are They Reliable?” to make this point point clear.
Thanks for bringing it up.
To add to what Seng Kiat wrote:
In contemplating Paticca Samuppada backwards (“patiloma”), one starts by replacing, “jati paccaya jara, marana,…” with “jati rirodha jara, marana..nirodha”.
Then, “bhava paccaya jati” is replaced by “bhava nirodha jati nirodha”, etc.
Then one can see some key insights.
For example, if one does not do “apunna abhisankhara”, no corresponding “bad vinnana” would arise that can lead to births in the apayas.So, it is not just repeating words. One needs to “see” how bad births can be stopped from arising by stopping corresponding abhi sankhara. Of course, as one forcefully stops such abhi sankhara, one’s “bad gati” would reduce over time.
– However, it is also essential to learn Dhamma to get rid of avijja, the root cause.Sorry I missed it.
A better statement would be “respecting and making offerings to those with higher virtues has no merits”.
That is what was in the post, “Micchā Ditthi, Gandhabba, and Sōtapanna Stage“, and I have revised it in the post you referred to.
“Those with higher virtues” could be human or devas.
Of course, devas do not need our food, for example. Making offerings there is a gesture, done with good intentions.
– However, I remember listening to a desana by Waharaka Thero, where he mentioned that those food offerings can be used by higher devas to feed their underlings (there are different levels, just like in the human world).
– He mentioned that when people offer nice-smelling fruits etc, just after the offering, the aroma would be gone (if it is done right). That means the “essence” (oja) of the food has been extracted.
– However, one does not need to offer large quantities. The higher devas can make the offering to “multiply” to feed many.
– I don’t want to get into that issue right now. This is not a critical issue, but could be beneficial.
– This is just like giving (dana) cannot directly lead to magga phala, but can help set the background.But we should ALWAYS give merits to ALL BEINGS.
firewns wrote: “I see vinnana as occurring at least three times within a single PS cycle.”
You are quite right. You have thought about this carefully! Paticca Samuppada can be analyzed in great detail.
You may also want to read the post: “Difference Between Tanhā and Upādāna“.
Also think about how different types of bhava (and jati) arise due to one’s own sankhara (which of course lead to corresponding vinnana). That understanding is very important.
“Gati to Bhava to Jāti – Ours to Control”P.S. In fact, this is one way to get rid of Sakkaya Ditthi and to attain the Sotapanna stage.
– There is no “soul” or “attā” or have an “ātma”, but only a form of living being (satvā) arising due to (abhi)sankhara. When one truly comprehends that, one would have removed Sakkaya Ditthi.
– Apunna abhisankhara lead to a satvā in the apayas.
– Punna abhisankhara lead to a satvā in the “realms of human, deva, and rupavacara brahma”.
– Anenja abhisankhara lead to a satvā in the “realms of arupavacara brahma”.
– When one cultivates the Noble Path, one’s panna will grow and would be optimum at the Arahant stage. Then one one would not do any more abhisankhara. Of course, an Arahant would still do sankhara until the death of the physical body.firewns wrote: “However, suppose that the being is either unaware of, or chooses not to obstruct tanha, so that it smoothly leads to upadana without much hindrance”.
Yes. That is why it is not possible to stop the rebirth process if one is not exposed to correct Buddha Dhamma.
On other questions:
“Tanha paccaya vinnana” does take place.“tanha paccaya rupa” happens only indirectly. For example, one’s next birth (and the accompanying body) arises due to a built-up vinnana. This is a deeper aspect.
I suggest reading the following to understand what is really meant by vinnana. This is something most people do not understand. Vinnana is all about “future expectations”:
I recommend reading the posts 3 through 6 in the following section:
“Essential Buddhism”and then read:
“Viññāna – What It Really Means”It is worthwhile to spend the time and understand vinnana.
firewns asked: “How can one meditate on reducing sanna and citta vipallasa about dukkha and asubha?”
One cannot reduce sanna and citta vipallasa DIRECTLY via meditation.
Those vipallasa are reduced when one cultivates panna by getting rid of the 10 types of miccha ditthi first, and then increasing one’s understanding on Tilakkhana (mainly the anicca nature).
– So, the meditation should be on Dhamma concepts.
– You may want to listen to the set of discourses on Tilakkhana:
“Three Marks of Existence – English Discourses“Mind can play tricks.
When one really starts comprehending Dhamma (suffering and its root causes), one can start feeling it mentally and bodily. This is described in the described in the Upanisa Sutta (SN 12.23):
“..With the comprehension of suffering (i.e., the First Noble Truth via Tilakkhana) faith results; with the growth of faith, lightness of mind (pāmojjaṃ) arises; with increasing lightness of mind, joy (piti) arises; with increasing joy, lightness of the body (passaddhi) arises; with increasing passaddhi, bodily sukha arises; with increasing bodily sukha, samādhi arises; with samādhi, yathābhūtañāṇadassana (knowledge and vision of things as they really are) arises; with the knowledge and vision of things as they really are, one loses attachment to worldly things (nibbidā), followed by losing cravings for sense pleasures (viragā), and liberation (vimutti), and to the destruction of all defilements (khayeñāṇaṃ)”.
That step-by-step process takes one all the way to Arahanthood.
Just published a post on this topic confirming what I stated above:
“Attha Purisa Puggalā- Eight Noble Persons“.We can discuss any remaining issues here. No need to open a new thread.
I will try to publish one more post before taking a break. But I will be able to take part in the forum until about the 14th. Then I will be taking a few weeks off.
You are welcome, Tealer!
You said: ‘ Phala-sammāpatti I understand as saññā vedayita nirodha.”
- saññā vedayita nirodha is the phala samapatti corresponding to the Arahant phala.
- Phala samapatti for lower stages of Nibbana are different. For example, a Sotapanna could cultivate Sotapanna phala samapatti.
You wrote: “For my understanding, Magga and phala itself (and the phala-sammāpatti even more) is a special kind of jhanic experience.”
As explained in the post, “Pannāvimutti – Arahanthood without Jhāna“, one could get to magga and phala without going through jhana.
You wrote: “So even the paññāvimutti Arahat must have at least some jhanic moments.”
It is possible that a paññāvimutti Arahant may automatically get to the first Ariya jhana. I am not certain about that. Of course, he/she would be easily able to cultivate jhanas after the Arahanthood.
– However, the Abhidhamma description of any magga phala involves only a gotrabu (change of lineage) citta; see at the end of the following post for a a short description: “Citta Vithi – Processing of Sense Inputs“.You asked: “do you think that every ubhatobhāga-vimutta must be (beside paññāvimutta) also akuppā cetovimutta?”
Ubhatobhāga Arahant means one who is liberated “both ways”.
– a cetovimutti ARAHANT is, by definition, an Ubhatobhāga Arahant.
– a paññāvimutti Arahant can become an Ubhatobhāga Arahant by cultivating jhana and getting to saññā vedayita nirodha.You may be also interested in the post, “Jhānic Experience in Detail – Sāmaññaphala Sutta (DN 2)“, which was published today.
This has been explained in detail:
Thank you, Tealer, for the detailed posting.
I think it is a good idea to first see the difference between cetovimutti and pannavimutti Arahants.
– I had started writing a post on the Tapussa Sutta that explains this well. So, I was able to finish it today, and I just published it:
“Tapussa Sutta (AN 9.41)– Akuppā Cētōvimutti”We can discuss more if you have questions. Please refer to the bullet numbers in the post, if you ask specific questions on it.
