Post on “Upaya and Upādāna – Two Stages of Attachment”

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    • #47912
      dosakkhayo
      Participant

      It is a minor issue.

      The recent post Kāma Guṇa – Origin of Attachment (Tanhā) wrote: #9 At the outset of that process, a “defiled viññāna” arises as “bahidda viññāna” and strengthens to “ajjhatta viññāna” via only “kāma saṅkappa” which are“mano kamma.

      So both bahidda viññāna and ajjhatta viññāna are different stages of kamma viññāna. Because those are defiled.

      Upaya and Upādāna – Two Stages of Attachment

      In #5 of the post, it said that “Generating “kāma saññā” happens just before kāma bhava while in the “bahidda viññāṇa” stage. An Arahant‘s mind does not go beyond the “bahidda viññāṇa” to get to the “ajjhatta viññāṇa” stage.”

      Arahant cannot have any defilement, so it should be modified. I think it is just a spelling mistake of ‘bahidda kaya’.

    • #48363
      dosakkhayo
      Participant

      It seems that this thread has not been checked by Lal. Could you please check it?

    • #48370
      Lal
      Keymaster

      You are right. I have revised #5 as below:

      5. Generating “kāma saññā” at this initial “kāma dhātu stage” does not mean one is already in the “kāma bhava.” Generating “kāma saññā” happens just before kāma bhava while in the “kāma dhātu” stage. An Arahant‘s mind does not go beyond the “kāma dhātu” stage. A kamma (with defiled intention or sañcetanā) must happen to get to the kāma bhava, as the Buddha explained in the “Paṭhamabhava Sutta (AN 3.76).”  

      • The “Paṭhamabhava Sutta (AN 3.76)” states “Kāmadhātuvepakkañca, ānanda, kammaṁ nābhavissa, api nu kho kāmabhavo paññāyethā”ti?” OR “If no kamma took place (kammaṁ nābhavissa), would the transition from kāma dhātu to kāma bhava come about?” The answer was “no.” 
      • That kamma happens in the “kāmasaññaṁ paṭicca uppajjati kāmasaṅkappo” step in #1 above. As we know, kamma is done with (abhi)saṅkhāra and “saṅkappa” means “citta saṅkhāra.” 
      • As the verse in #1 shows, “kāma saṅkappa” arises (kāma saññaṁ paṭicca uppajjati kāma saṅkappo) in the second step. Let us carefully go through the steps involved.
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