Mahā Cattārisaka Sutta (Discourse on the Great Forty)

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    • #22270
      firewns
      Participant

      In the post ‘Mahā Cattārisaka Sutta (Discourse on the Great Forty)‘, one type of micca ditthi would be thinking that there are no benefits to making offerings to devas and other beings.

      1) May I know what kind of other beings could be referred to?
      2) What kinds of benefits will making offerings to devas and such other beings bring about?
      3) What could be some suitable offerings?
      4) If the devas and other beings these offerings are being made to already have sufficient quantities of such things, and furthermore in much superior quality (e.g. devas may have access to tastier food than we can ever hope to cook), would we still gain merit from such offerings?
      5) What would be the best kind of attitude to have when making such offerings?

      Thank you very much in advance for your answers to my questions.

    • #22301
      firewns
      Participant

      Lal,

      It seems that you may have missed out on my questions here. Just writing a short note to get your attention.

    • #22305
      Lal
      Keymaster

      Sorry I missed it.

      A better statement would be “respecting and making offerings to those with higher virtues has no merits”.

      That is what was in the post, “Micchā Ditthi, Gandhabba, and Sōtapanna Stage“, and I have revised it in the post you referred to.

      “Those with higher virtues” could be human or devas.

      Of course, devas do not need our food, for example. Making offerings there is a gesture, done with good intentions.
      – However, I remember listening to a desana by Waharaka Thero, where he mentioned that those food offerings can be used by higher devas to feed their underlings (there are different levels, just like in the human world).
      – He mentioned that when people offer nice-smelling fruits etc, just after the offering, the aroma would be gone (if it is done right). That means the “essence” (oja) of the food has been extracted.
      – However, one does not need to offer large quantities. The higher devas can make the offering to “multiply” to feed many.
      – I don’t want to get into that issue right now. This is not a critical issue, but could be beneficial.
      – This is just like giving (dana) cannot directly lead to magga phala, but can help set the background.

      But we should ALWAYS give merits to ALL BEINGS.

    • #23007
      Tobias G
      Participant

      The Sutta says: “…there are twenty factors on the side of the wholesome, and twenty factors on the side of the unwholesome.”

      Lal speaks about 10 outcomes of each path. What are the 10 results of each path and what are the 20 factors for each side? I do not get the information clear from the sutta as well as from Lals essay.

      What I understand is that we have 10 micca ditthi + 10 akusala kamma on the side of the unwholesome. Are that the “factors”?

    • #23013
      Lal
      Keymaster

      The 20 factors on the wholesome side are the removal of the 10 types of miccha ditthi and getting to the 10 factors in the Noble Path: Sammā Ditthi, Sammā Sankappa, Sammā Vācā, Sammā Kammanta, Sammā Ājiva, Sammā Vāyāma, Sammā Sati, Sammā Samādhi, Sammā Ñāna, and Sammā Vimutti.
      – Note here that one needs to complete two more factors (Sammā Ñāna, and Sammā Vimutti) beyond the eightfold path factors to become an Arahant.

      When one has one or more miccha ditthi, one is on the wrong path. Those are the first 10 factors on the unwholesome side.
      When one has many of those miccha ditthi, one will be going down the wrong path, and will end up with unwholesome 10 factors that are opposite of the 10 factors for an Arahant: micchā Ditthi, micchā Sankappa, micchā Vācā, micchā Kammanta, micchā Ājiva, micchā Vāyāma, micchā Sati, micchā Samādhi, micchā Ñāna, and micchā Vimutti.

      So, those are 20 factors to the unwholesome side.

      Even though those last 10 factors are not explicitly stated in the Maha Cattarisaka sutta, they are implicated there. Those are explicitly stated in several suttas including “Sādhu Sutta (AN 10.134)” and “Micchatta Sutta (an 10.103)“.

      I may need to re-write the post on Maha Cattarisaka sutta to make this more clear.

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