- This topic has 9 replies, 4 voices, and was last updated 3 years ago by Anonymous.
May 28, 2020 at 11:28 am #29804AnonymousInactive
Like absence of dark is light and vice versa…. is absence of suffering happiness ….. I don’t feel so.
May 28, 2020 at 11:48 am #29805
Yes. There are “sukha vedana” that bring happiness. But such “happy feelings” do not last very long, especially in the rebirth process.
On the other hand, the total absence of suffering is the “happiness” that cannot be taken away.
– That happiness is NOT created by a cause (like buying a new car or building a new house.)
– Any happiness that can arise due to “material things” does not last long, especially in the rebirth process.
– At least at the moment of death, one WILL have to give up those “things” that bring happiness.
Of course, this requires some contemplation.
Also, if one does not believe in rebirth, it could be harder to understand.
May 28, 2020 at 11:54 am #29806AnonymousInactive
Happiness is an illusion for me . World doesn’t make me happy and beyond world I don’t know . Yet I am not unhappy unless ofcourse strong mental or physical vedanta arise . So what state is it ?
May 28, 2020 at 1:32 pm #29807cubibobiParticipant
Here’s my 2-cent on this, which is based just on personal encounters with several people in my life.
— Mahi wrote:
“Yet I am not unhappy unless ofcourse strong mental or physical vedanta arise.”
I assume you meant “vedana”, and they WILL arise.
I have met several people who took on a gung-ho attitude toward life, asserting: “I can take on the ups and downs of life.” The problem was that they made this statement when they were young and things were going “their way”. This attitude goes away when they are faced with strong mental or physical afflictions; in some cases, they come suddenly (viparinama), in others, they come due to aging and declining.
What we’ve learned in Buddha Dhamma is that this can be stopped from FUTURE arising, and that is real happiness, which is not as illusory as you think if you have experienced some niramisa sukha. There are several posts on niramisa sukha here.
May 29, 2020 at 5:48 am #29808
Mahi wrote: “Happiness is an illusion for me . World doesn’t make me happy and beyond world I don’t know . Yet I am not unhappy unless ofcourse strong mental or physical vedanta arise . So what state is it ?”
I am intrigued by your comment.
– Normally, people have a hard time controlling their tendency for sensual pleasures.
– Is this something that you have experienced since childhood?
– Was there some trauma that took place in early childhood?
Of course, you don’t need to provide details if you are uncomfortable with it.
May 29, 2020 at 7:51 am #29815y notParticipant
“….is absence of suffering happiness ….. I don’t feel so.”
It is not, Mahi. Consider this case. A patient is in pain (suffering). Medics apply medicines and other treatment and the pain goes.(absence of suffering). After that, his wife or gf visits. (happiness).
Now if the pain returns (while the wife or gf, the source of happiness, is still there) at once the happiness is gone. So there can be no lasting happiness where suffering exists or comes to exist at some point. (the 31 realms) .
You say : ‘Happiness is an illusion for me..world doesn’t make me happy..yet I am not unhappy unless of course strong mental or physical vedana arise” So, since you ask what state it is, I say it is the neutral state. But as you have seen yourself “unless of course strong mental or physical vedana arise”; you of course mean strong BAD mental or physical vedana. Not’unless’, Mahi, they WILL surely come, if not sooner then later. So there can be no permanent ‘neutral state’ of neither-happiness-nor-unhappiness either.
So strive for Nibbana. That alone is true happiness.
May 30, 2020 at 11:14 pm #29843AnonymousInactive
Yes Nibbana is only permanent solution. Intense suffering would have been more often in absence of understanding of Buddha’s teachings. But understanding of these teachings mostly dilutes the intensity of sufferings. Still Too painful mental and physical state do come and go and that is when I am not being mindful ….and more interesting,sometimes even when I am mindful it stays …. … But yes happiness is still an illusion . What can make one happy other than Nibbana ? Need to look deeper into my sensations and feelings. Sense organs are not at rest ….they are still seeking and demanding but the resultant pleasure seem to be missing. May be Jhanas can bring a state of happiness?
May 30, 2020 at 11:51 pm #29844AnonymousInactive
No life was never a joy ride . But before the techings of Buddha came to my understanding I always worked hard to counter sufferings and kept on creating what I considered then as happiness . Now there is no such desire to pursue for those so called happiness.But this creates a dullness a void. When you stop chasing it kicks in a restlessness.Only thing I know for sure I want to chase is Buddha’s teachings.But these teachings gradually increase the urge to renunciate , which is not possible rt now. And later who knows .
May 31, 2020 at 7:09 am #29848
Mahi wrote: “Now there is no such desire to pursue for those so called happiness.But this creates a dullness a void. When you stop chasing it kicks in a restlessness.Only thing I know for sure I want to chase is Buddha’s teachings.But these teachings gradually increase the urge to renunciate , which is not possible rt now.”
Buddha did not teach to renunciate (give up) worldly things.
– He taught WHY holding onto to worldly things lead to suffering.
– One will SEE the fruitlessness and dangers in CRAVING for worldly things once one understands the real nature of this world.
Let us take an analogy.
– It is very difficult to give up drinking for an alcoholic.
– If he tries to just forcefully stop drinking, that may only lead to depression.
– But he truly understands the CONSEQUENCES of drinking, he can gradually cut down the habit to drink.
So, my suggestion is to keep learning Dhamma AND to live a simple life (the Middle Way).
– Remember that the Buddha not only advised to stay away from TOO MUCH sense pleasures. He also advised not to WILFULLY subject oneself to austerity (depriving the body of a moderate level of comforts)
– The “giving up” (getting rid of tanha) comes naturally via understanding (via getting rid of avijja about this world), at the level of one’s understanding.
June 2, 2020 at 5:33 am #29886AnonymousInactive
Very aptly explained by you . Thankyou . ???
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