[dosakkhayo]

SN12.17 Acelakassapasutta

Kiṁ nu kho, bho gotama, ‘sayaṅkataṁ dukkhan’ti?

‘Mā hevaṁ, kassapā’ti bhagavā avoca.

‘Kiṁ pana, bho gotama, paraṅkataṁ dukkhan’ti?

‘Mā hevaṁ, kassapā’ti bhagavā avoca.

‘Kiṁ nu kho, bho gotama, sayaṅkatañca paraṅkatañca dukkhan’ti?

‘Mā hevaṁ, kassapā’ti bhagavā avoca.

‘Kiṁ pana, bho gotama, asayaṅkāraṁ aparaṅkāraṁ adhiccasamuppannaṁ dukkhan’ti?

‘Mā hevaṁ, kassapā’ti bhagavā avoca.

marker 5.1

“‘So karoti so paṭisaṁvedayatī’ti kho, kassapa, ādito sato ‘sayaṅkataṁ dukkhan’ti iti vadaṁ sassataṁ etaṁ pareti.

‘Añño karoti añño paṭisaṁvedayatī’ti kho, kassapa, vedanābhitunnassa sato ‘paraṅkataṁ dukkhan’ti iti vadaṁ ucchedaṁ etaṁ pareti.

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I have three things I’m curious about.

Q1. I’d like to know the meaning of the four expressions above. Are these all incorrect ideas about kamma? I would appreciate a detailed explanation about them.

Q2. I want to understand why sayaṅkataṁ dukkhan is connected to sassata ditthi, and why paraṅkataṁ dukkhan is connected to uccheda ditthi.

Q3. I’m also curious why sayaṅkatañca paraṅkatañca dukkhan or asayaṅkāraṁ aparaṅkāraṁ adhiccasamuppannaṁ dukkhan are not mentioned. What is the meaning of each of them?

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pathfinder

[Lal]

Here, “sa” indicates “oneself,” and “para” indicates “someone else” or “not oneself.” Also. “kata” means “action” in the sense of “who is responsible.”

• “‘sayaṅkataṁ dukkhan’ti?” means “Is suffering caused by oneself?”
• “paraṅkataṁ dukkhan’ti?” means “Is suffering caused by someone else?”
• “sayaṅkatañ ca paraṅkatañ ca dukkhan’ti?” means “Is suffering caused by oneself and someone else?” Here “ca” is used to indicate “and”.
• “asayaṅkāraṁ aparaṅkāraṁ adhiccasamuppannaṁ dukkhan’ti?” means “Is suffering NOT caused by oneself or someone else but happens without a cause?”

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Q2. I want to understand why sayaṅkataṁ dukkhan is connected to sassata ditthi, and why paraṅkataṁ dukkhan is connected to uccheda ditthi.

• The explanation is here: “Acelakassapa Sutta (SN 12.17)“: ” Suppose that the person who does the deed experiences the result. Then, for one who has existed since the beginning, suffering is made by oneself. This statement leans toward eternalism (sassata).” Here, since the “same person” who goes through the rebirth process, one is supposed to experience the results of past kamma (done by oneself).”
• On the other hand, since one with uccheda ditthi does not believe in the concept of a soul-like entity doing everything and reaping the consequences, here the explanation (@5.2) is based on the idea “it is not the same person who does the kamma and reaps the consequence of that kamma” per annihilationism (uccheda ditthi). 
• Of course, Buddha’s explanation is neither of those. Kammas may or may not lead to future vipaka, and it is only a process based on causes and conditions (Paticca Samuppada). Here, there is no reference to an “unchanging self.”  Yet, it does not deny that there is a person doing kamma and there is also a person experiencing vipaka; they are not the same but causally connected.

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Q3. I’m also curious why sayaṅkatañca paraṅkatañca dukkhan or asayaṅkāraṁ aparaṅkāraṁ adhiccasamuppannaṁ dukkhan are not mentioned. What is the meaning of each of them?

• It is there @ 3.7: “‘Kiṁ pana, bho gotama, asayaṅkāraṁ aparaṅkāraṁ adhiccasamuppannaṁ dukkhan’ti?”
• The explanation should be clear from the above.

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pathfinder, dosakkhayo

[dosakkhayo]

Sadhu! Sadhu! Sadhu!

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