December 12, 2020 at 5:34 am #32741
Please see the post Ten Immoral Actions (Dasa Akusala). In #1 the immoral acts done with the mind are called mano sankhara, but mano sankhara are sanna and vedana where no kamma is generated. I think the term mano sankhara is misleading in regard to akusala kamma. You could call it three immoral acts done with the mind.
December 12, 2020 at 5:49 am #32742
Is dasa akusala defined in the Tipitaka as immoral mano, vaci, kaya sankhara? When I see the post Dasa Akusala/Dasa Kusala – Basis of Buddha Dhamma -2 there is no term like this. Many sutta are mentioned there.
December 12, 2020 at 7:23 am #32747LalKeymaster
1. Mano sankhara still contribute to akusala kamma (because they get generated due to avijja).
– However, those are “weak” kamma and do not lead to rebirths, i.e., they are not abhisankhara.
2. The way to ultimately control mano sankhara is to control vaci and kaya sankhara and thereby reducing one’s bad gati.
– That is the key to Anapanasati/Satipatthana.
I have revised the post “Ten Immoral Actions (Dasa Akusala)” to explain that.
– More details are in the post, “Correct Meaning of Vacī Sankhāra” referred there.
All ten types of akusala are done with saṅkhāra via “avijjā paccayā saṅkhāra.”
December 13, 2020 at 5:18 am #32757
Yes, agreed. But mano sankhara belong to vipaka citta and do not generate kamma. Dasa akusala means bad kamma. Thus the term mano sankhara is somehow misleading; the term “micca sankappa” is better (“wrong thoughts with intention”).
Of course Paṭiccasamuppādavibhaṅga includes the 3 categories mano …, vaci…, kaya sankhara for the PS step “avijja paccaya sankhara”. One needs to know the context in which the term mano sankhara is used.
December 13, 2020 at 7:39 am #32759LalKeymaster
“But mano sankhara belong to vipaka citta and do not generate kamma. ”
Yes. mano sankhara arise in vipaka citta. But those vipaka citta are also contaminated to VARYING DEGREE for ANY citta other than the Arahant phala citta.
– This is a technical point. But if one digs deeper, one can understand Buddha Dhamma at a deeper level.
1. All citta have 7 universal cetasika and vedana, sanna are two of them. Thus, vedana and sanna arise with ANY and ALL citta.
– Mano sankhara are defined as, “vedana sanna mano sankhara.”
– Therefore, Tobias is right that even vipaka citta have mano sankhara.
2. However, ANY citta contaminates AS IT ARISES in a very fast process in 9 stages. That “contamination level” depends on the person (one’s gati) and also on the particular thought object (arammana.) See, “Amazingly Fast Time Evolution of a Thought (Citta)”
– Even an Arahant’s citta gets “contaminated” up to the “manasan” stage. Unless it gets to the “manasan” stage, one is unable to recognize a person as one’s mother, for example.
– However, in an Arahant phala citta (experienced only when an Arahant is in Arahant phala samapatti), that Arahant is at the initial PURE citta stage. There the Arahant is only AWARE that he/she is alive. This is called a pabhassara citta.
3. Therefore, the bottom line is that even vipaka citta are contaminated at varying degrees.
– Mano sankhara are also defined as “mano sancetana mano sankhara”.
– There the “sancetana” part takes int account the AUTOMATIC contamination of a citta as described above.
4. However, those sankhara DO NOT become abhisankhara until we start consciously accumulating more “san” or “raga, dosa, moha” by repeatedly and consciously thinking (vitakka/vicara) IF we get attached to that arammana.
– This is why vaci sankhara are defined as “vitakka vicara vaci sankhara” as explained in the post on vaci sankhara that I referred to in my original reply.
5. That is why mano sankhara do not lead to STRONG kamma, especially those responsible for rebirth.
– It is only vaci sankhara and kaya sankhara that can lead to strong kamma leading to rebirth, or even kamma vipaka of significance during lifetimes (like getting injured).
Thre following post and other posts referred to there can provide more information: “Vipāka Vēdanā and “Samphassa jā Vēdanā” in a Sensory Event”
Please don’t hesitate to ask questions. One can get a deeper understanding by “digging deeper.”
But the most important thing is to stop bad vaci and kaya sankhara (bad vaci and kaya kamma). We will become conscious of them when those airse. That is the basis of Anapana and Satipatthana meditations.
– As I have emphasized many time, vaci sankhara is NOT limited to speaking. If one CONSCIOUSLY think with raga, dosa, moha, those are also vaci sankhara.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.