Macchariya in Abhidhammattha sangaha

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  • This topic has 5 replies, 2 voices, and was last updated 6 months ago by Lal.
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    • #31595
      Billy
      Participant

      Hi Lal,
      I have read Abhidhammattha sangaha I was wondering why in this book it was written Macchariya cetasika coupled with Dosa citta.
      If Macchariya cetasika is extreme greed, why isn’t it coupled with Lobha citta?
      I also wondered if this book was all correctly transmitted. Has the Pali sentence been written in the wrong position or has someone secretly converted the Pali message?
      Thank you for creating this website,
      Billy

    • #31596
      Lal
      Keymaster

      Hello Billy!

      You asked, “I was wondering why in this book it was written Macchariya cetasika coupled with Dosa citta.
      If Macchariya cetasika is extreme greed, why isn’t it coupled with Lobha citta?”

      Could you quote the actual verse in the Abhidhammattha Sangaha?
      – Or, you could just give me the page number so that I can look it up.

    • #31599
      Lal
      Keymaster

      The following post is from Billy:

      Hi Lal
      Really glad to hear from you.
      Here this is my reply that disappeared.

      (captured from Abhidhamma book and web)

      Macchariya (Stinginess)

      Dosa, Issa, and Macchariya

      Just as I read that book in the Thai translation, I responded a little late because I had to search for an English translation that has the same meaning as Thai.

      Abhidhammattha Sangaha in the Abhidhamma schools has been teaching for many decades, which taught that “Macchariya is cetasika, one of the Dosa team because it arises with Dosa citta.” Even the English translation teaches this way too.

      But I feel it is wrong Because the opposite of Macchariya is Caga, one of Ariyadhana. I feel that Macchariya is cetasika, one of the Lobha team, and arise with Lobha citta + Miccha ditthi because the one who can completely cut Macchariya is Sotapanna puggala. But I didn’t find that Abhidhamma school would teach like this And the professors here often look at those who do not agree with the books of the Abhidhamma School Is the bad people that destroy Buddha dhamma, so I can only keep in mind until today.

      I’ve been following your online writing for four years, but I’m not good at English (100%Thai). I have to use Google Translate every time to write, but I can read and understand the meaning of English immediately (It’s very strange).

    • #31600
      Lal
      Keymaster

      Here are some things to think about.

      1. Mōha (delusion); Ahirika (shamelessness); Anottapa (fearlessness in wrong); uddhacca (restlessness or agitation) arise in ALL akusala cittas.

      2. Only lobha or dosa can arise in a given akusala citta. Both CANNOT arise together.

      3. Of course, dosa (or hatred/anger) arises when one does not get one’s desire fulfilled. That desire/carving arise due to lobha. Therefore, lobha and dosa are connected in a way, even though they cannot arise together.

      The following are directly related to your question:

      4. Out of 12 akusala cittas, lobha arises in EIGHT types (lobha-rooted cittas). (see p. 32 of Ref.1 below).
      – Lobha (greed) arises ONLY in those 8 cittas. (see p. 95 of Ref.1 below).

      5. There are only TWO Dosa-rooted akusala cittas. (see p. 36 of Ref.1 below).
      – Dosa, issa, macchariya, and kukkucca can arise ONLY in those two types of cittas. (see p. 95 of Ref.1 below).
      – Note that dosa, issa, macchariya, and kukkucca are listed in English as hatred, envy, avarice, and worry in Ref. 1.

      Ref.1:Comprehensive Manual of Abhidhamma by Bhikkhu Bodhi

      The page numbers quoted above are the page numbers indicated on each page of Ref. 1.

      The main point is the following.
      – Issa, macchariya, and kukkucca are not “pure greed.”
      – Just like dosa, they arise as a by-product of greed.
      – I looked up the standard definition of avarice. It says, “extreme greed for wealth or material gain.” That is not the meaning of macchariya. Macchariya means when someone who has a lot of wealth tries to hide it from others, due to his fear that he may have to it share his wealth with others.
      – Issa is jealousy.
      – So, we can see that all four cetasika of dosa, issa, macchariya, and kukkucca are not PURE GREED. They are all byproducts of greed (lobha). They can arise ONLY in those two types of cittas in #5 above.

    • #31605
      Lal
      Keymaster

      The following post is from Billy:

      Hi Lal, Thank you very much for your answer.

      I read another meaning of Macchariya that means selfishness I want to know if selfishness is the meaning of Macchariya? Because this meaning will make people think that Macchariya is in the Lobha team.

      My friend also sent me a link to the Pali Mahāniddeso jarāsuttaniddeso page
      She told me to see {206.1}

      She asked me why the Lord Buddha taught that Macchariya is the same group as Lobha.
      But after I read your answer in this post, I immediately believed that your answer was correct, but I still didn’t understand much. I would like to thank you once again for writing the answer as well.

    • #31607
      Lal
      Keymaster

      Hello Billy,

      The verse that you refer to lists five types of macchariya: macchariya for residences, one’s caste, profit, health, and knowledge.
      – One would be reluctant to share any of those with others. So, such a person would try to hide them from others.

      Macchariya is sort fo the opposite of issa or jealousy. In that case, one would envious of such possessions of others.

      As I said, just like dosa is a manifestation of greed, those are also different manifestations of greed.
      – But they are not pure greed (lobha).

      When avijja and tanha are removed, lobha, dosa, and all other associated cetasika would not arise.

      By the way, raga (kama raga, rupa raga, arupa raga) are lower levels of lobha.
      – See, “Lōbha, Dōsa, Mōha versus Rāga, Patigha, Avijjā

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