Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
This has been discussed under a couple of topics in the forum.
Here is one:
“Four Conditions for Attaining Sōtapanna Magga/Phala”The main conclusions are:
1. The Sotapanna Anugami stage can be reached by reading/listening.
2. The Sotapanna phala moment (transition from a Sotapanna Anugami to a Sotapanna) happens while listening to a discourse by a Noble Person (Ariya).
– “Saddamma savana” or “listening to the correct Dhamma” is what is given as a requirement in the Tipitaka.
– Of course, reading was not widely available at the time of the Buddha.Mahendran asked: “Aren’t Our gathi and inherited abilities for certain subject areas such as music, dance,languages, maths etc etc..partly due to the genes of the parents?”
No. It is the other way around.
Gandhabba had cultivated such gati in previous lives.
A gandhabba is drawn into a womb that has a zygote which maximizes the possibility of continuing the “gati” of the gandhabba.
– That zygote has a set of chromosomes, half of which is from the mother and half from the father.
– But those chromosomes dictate mostly the physical features.
– Matching of other types of gati is determined by kammic energy.
– Some physical features as well as “gati” could come from mother or father. Some gati could be just the gati of gandhabba.
– Once born, that baby’s gati could be changed due to the influence of both mother and father (and others in the family, friends, etc).See the first several posts in the section “Origin of Life”
Those posts will answer the following question as a resounding YES: “Does it mean that gandhabba will also contribute to the abilities and the nature of the personality as a whole in addition?”
Mostly the physical features of the baby will be determined by the chromosomes. Gandhabba has its own gati.
– But of course, kammic process will try to match gati as well. But that is never going to be even close. Even the mother and father would have different gati. That “matching” would be a very broad overlap.It is a complex process. We can only get a rough idea.
Today, I received an email from Janith Boniface Fernando. He is the person who had compiled the Waharaka Thero Discourses with English subtitles.
He has sent me the English and Sinhala text files for the three videos that he has published so far.
– I am posting the three videos in the correct order together with the pdf for his English translations.
– Of course, yesterday I posted my revised and expanded English text for the first video above. I will post the rest of my expanded translation for that first video above so that the complete text will be available there.
– Many merits to Janith Fernando for sharing with us these files.First Video:
English and Sinhala text for the First Discourse
Second Video:
English and Sinhala text for the Second Discourse
Third Video:
English and Sinhala text for the Third Discourse
June 25, 2020
Fourth Video:English-and-Sinhala-Text-Fourth-Discourse.pdf
June 28, 2020
Fifth Video:What is the ideal way to attain Nirvana leading a lay life – Part 05
July 11, 2020
Sixth Video:What is the ideal way to attain Nirvana leading a lay life – Part 06
July 28, 2020
Seventh Video:What is the ideal way to attain Nibbana leading a lay life – Part 07
Aug. 15, 2020
Eighth Video:Septemeber 11, 2020 – Ninth Video
I have not received the text files for the last two.
Thank you for the article and your quote from it, oetb.
– I will read the article when I find some time.Yes. It would be a good idea to address this in a post OR in a detailed comment here. I will try to get to it ASAP.
This issue is related to what I briefly touched on in the recent post, “Difference Between “Me and Mine” and Sakkāya Diṭṭhi”
I am pasting the last part of the post below:
11. Many people have the perception that Buddha Gotama “adopted” that five-fold analysis from the Vedas because those terms appeared in Vedic literature before Buddha Gotama.
– There was Buddha Kassapa on this Earth before Buddha Gotama. Buddha Kassapa’s teachings (especially the true meanings of key concepts) were lost with time. But many terms, including the concepts of kamma, kamma vipāka, five aggregates, and many others, were incorporated into Vedic teachings and transmitted through many generations. Of course, the Vedic teachings used the Sanskrit language, which was derived from Pāli or Magadha language. Sanskrit means “derived from” (“san” + “krutha” or සන් කෘත or සංස්කෘත in Sinhala.)
– The Pāli words like kamma, Nibbāna, Paṭicca Samuppāda were made “more impressive-sounding” by mostly adding the “r” sound. Those three Pāli words became karma, nirvāna, and Pratītyasamutpāda, respectively, in Sanskrit.
– The same is true for the concept of five aggregates or pañca khandha. The Vedic teachings adopted them as five Skandhas.Whose Concepts are Kamma, Nibbāna, Paṭicca Samuppāda, etc.?
12. A full account requires possibly a whole book. But there are several instances in the Tipitaka where Buddha Gotama explained to various Brahmins that many of their teachings originated with Buddha Kassapa.
– For example, in the Māgandhiya Sutta (MN 75), Buddha Gotama has a conversation with a Brahmin who quoted a verse from the Vedas. Buddha Gotama then says that verse was initially uttered by Buddha Kassapa and that it come down through generations in the Vedas without the true meaning. I have discussed that in the post, “Arōgyā Paramā Lābhā..“
– When Prince Siddhartha was born, such Vedic teachings were there. We have a somewhat similar situation right now, with many vital concepts misinterpreted.
– I mentioned the above because I see in online forums many people wonder whether Buddha Gotama “adopted” Vedic concepts. Those concepts originally came from Buddha Kassapa. But any Buddha discovers them by his own efforts.
– Then the question comes up as to the “evolution of humans.” There was no evolution of humans. Humans existed on Earth (with Brahma-like bodies) at the beginning of the Earth. This is why it would take a book to discuss all these things. I have given a brief account of the “beginnings” in “Buddhism and Evolution – Aggañña Sutta (DN 27).”***
Furthermore, there is much confusion about the key Pali words anicca and anatta because many people confuse those with Sanskrit words anitya and anatma. There are no words in Sanskrit that provide the same meaning of anicca and anatta. That is discussed in the post that you quoted above.
– That is why the Buddha said not to translate the Tipitaka, especially to Sanskrit.
– The idea was to transmit the Tipitaka in Pali and to explain the content in any language.I have completed revising and expanding of the document for the first desana (posted by cubibobi on May 31, 2020). The first video posted by Christian posted on May 29, 2020 is the second video in the series.
– I have done only half of the desana. I just wanted to get it out since it is fairly long.
– It may take me a few more days to complete the second half of the desana.June 26, 2020: Here is the full text of the FIRST transcribed discourse;
The Way to NibbānaThe original document was drafted off of the above-mentioned video with English subtitles by Janith Boniface Fernando. A Word document was made using that English text by Lair Valio Alves and Seng Kiat Ng.
– Many merits to all who contributed to this effort!P.S. July 6, 2020: I have updated a revised version.
That is right.
The statement that you quoted, “This means one is essentially an Anāgami by the time one is fully absorbed in the first Ariya jhāna”, is correct.
But there can be Anagamis who are not able to get into any jhana. Of course, they can spend time and cultivate jhana.
All three questions presume that jhanas are necessary to attain magga phala. That is not correct.
1. First, jhana are two types: Ariya and anariya.
2. One can attain magga phala (Anagami, Arahant, etc.) without attaining any type of jhana.
– The ability to get into jhana comes with practicing to get to jhana.
– It also depends on whether one had cultivated jhana in recent previous lives.Therefore, some Anagamis may never get into a jhana. Even an Anagami who has cultivated jhana, will not be in jhana all the time.
– Losing kama raga is different from getting into a jhana.
– An Anagami would not have kama raga whether in a jhana or not.All other questions need to be analyzed the same way.
See the first few posts in:
“Samādhi, Jhāna (Dhyāna), Magga Phala”Thank you, Aniduan.
I saw the following being referred to as a good resource for a beginner. I am not sure how good it is:
It will play the whole series sequentially. You can also select different lessons by using the hamburger selector on the top.
It turned out that the English transcriptions for both videos need substantial revision. Please see my revised comments above.
– However, I must thank both the person who had done the original transcription and also Lair for their efforts. I can appreciate how much time each of them would have spent. Much merits to them and their families!
– Yet, the goal of all of us is to make the teachings of the Buddha available to others to the best of our ability. I should have checked the document before posting it. It was my fault for not doing that.What Pali phrase means “the fathom long body”?
– In the incorrect translation that you cited, they translated “byāmamatte kaḷevare” as “the fathom long body”.
– There is no easy, direct translation for that. The meaning is in my translation above.
Thank you, Lang, for bringing up this important sutta with a deep meaning.
First, the background of the sutta. A fairly good translation that provides the background is, “With Rohitassa (AN 4.45)”
A Deva named Rohitassa comes to the Buddha and asks, “Is it possible to know or see or reach the end of the world by traveling to a place where there’s no being born, growing old, dying, passing away, or being reborn?”
– The Buddha says it is impossible to PHYSICALLY get to the end of the world (universe, in modern-day terminology).
– Rohitassa Deva said that he confirmed that by himself. He said that in a previous life, he was a yogi with supernormal powers who could travel vast distances (with his gandhabba body). One day he took off to try to get to the “end of the world”. Of course, no matter how much he traveled, there was no “end”. He died on the way.To get in idea of how vast the universe is, see the following video: “Carl Sagan “100 Billion Galaxies each W/100 Billion Stars”
Then the Buddha says:
“Na kho panāhaṃ, āvuso, appatvā lokassa antaṃ dukkhassa antakiriyaṃ vadāmi. Api ca khvāhaṃ, āvuso, imasmiṃyeva byāmamatte kaḷevare sasaññimhi samanake lokañcapaññapemi lokasamudayañca lokanirodhañca lokanirodha-gāminiñca paṭipadanti.”The translation of that verse is better from Lang’s quote (EXCEPT for the part that I highlighted):
“Friend, I do not say that all suffering will cease without reaching the end of the world, but I say that the world lies within this fathom long body, which possesses mind and perception. I also teach the origin of the world, the cessation of the world, and the way leading to the cessation of the world.”A better translation would be (just the meaning): “Friend, I do say that all suffering will not cease without reaching the end of the world. But “reaching the end of the world” is possible without going anywhere. It can be done with this body that possesses mind and perception. One just needs to comprehend the mechanism that “bears this world”. I also teach the origin of the world, the cessation of the world, and the way leading to the cessation of the world.”
Let us discuss briefly what the Buddha meant by that verse.
To see the context, let us look at Rohitassa’s first question stated above: “Is it possible to know or see or reach the end of the world by traveling to a place where there’s no being born, growing old, dying, passing away, or being reborn?”
So, the Buddha is saying that getting to a place where there’s no being born, growing old, dying, passing away, or being reborn is possible by following the Noble Eightfold Path. That goal is attained upon the Parinibbana of an Arahant. There will be no more births in this world.
– That is the “end of the world”, the death of an Arahant. He/she will not be reborn anywhere in this world of 31 realms. That is reaching the “end of the world.”One comprehends the suffering associated with the rebirth process by comprehending the anicca, dukkha, anatta nature.
– The rebirth process continues with the akusala-mula Paticca Samuppada starting with “avijja paccaya sankhara”. That means one will be tempted to do immoral deeds via abhisankhara. Here “avijja” is not to realize the anicca nature, i.e., that remaining in this world (i.e. in the rebirth process) will only lead to much suffering.
– That process always ends up with “bhava paccaya jati” and “jati paccaya jars, Marina, soka, parideva,…(or the “whole mass of suffering)”When one gets to the Arahant stage, the akusala-mula Paticca Samuppada process stops and the Arahant WOULD NOT grasp a new bhava at death. That is the “end of the world.” That is the end of all suffering!
The following post is from Lang (cubibobi):
Hi,
The “revival” of this thread prompted me to ask another question. Could somebody please explain the following section from the Rohitassa Sutta:
“Na kho panāhaṃ, āvuso, appatvā lokassa antaṃ dukkhassa antakiriyaṃ vadāmi. Api ca khvāhaṃ, āvuso, imasmiṃyeva byāmamatte kaḷevare sasaññimhi samanake lokañcapaññapemi lokasamudayañca lokanirodhañca lokanirodha-gāminiñca paṭipadanti.”
One translation of it is:
“Friend, I do not say that all suffering will cease without reaching the end of the world, but I say that the world lies within this fathom long body, which possesses mind and perception. I also teach the origin of the world, the cessation of the world, and the way leading to the cessation of the world.”
The above Pali verse and translation are from a book about Mahasi Sayadaw’s vipassana method.
On the Nature of Nibbana
page 67 (of the book)Below is the context of my question.
I practiced Goenka’s technique for quite some time, and gave a description of a 10-day course earlier in this thread. In brief, the technique takes bodily vedanā as the object of meditation (kammatthāna). The practitioner scans attention from head to toes and note the vedanā that arise and pass away. Seeing this arising and passing of vedanā is seeing the annica nature of vedanā.
They say that the technique has basis in the Satipatthana Sutta but focuses narrowly on just vedanā out of the four: kaya, vedanā, sankharā, dhammā. This is because to observe vedanā is to observe all. The main rationale for this is 2-fold, based on other places outside the Satipatthana Sutta:
(1) The verse “vedanā-samosaraṇā sabbe dhammā”. They translated this as “Everything that arises in the mind starts flowing with a sensation on the body.” Lal already addressed this earlier in the thread, about the real meaning of the verse.
(2) The above verse in the Rohitassa Sutta and they translated it pretty much as above.
Does this Pali section really mean as the translation? This section is actually used quite often in the traditions of body-based meditation techniques, the part about the “fathom-long body”. I don’t know Pali, but as I scan the Pali section I do not see the word “kaya” (body).
Thank you so much. This point was actually much on my mind before and now got the surface again.
Hello, firewns,
You wrote: “Asobhana cetasikas may also condition maha kusala cittas, maha vipaka cittas and maha kiriya cittas. Yet this point is not stressed in your writing, and due to the way it is worded, unwary people may think that asobhana cetasikas always condition akusala cittas, which is not true.”
I think you have got it wrong. Asobhana cetasika (bad mental factors) arise ONLY in akusala citta.
Next you wrote, “This is because asobhana cetasikas include all cetasikas that are not sobhana, including the annasamana cetasikas (7 sabbacitta-sadharana and 6 pakinnaka), as well as 14 akusala cetasikas such as lobha and dosa.”
I have highlighted the root problem in your statement. Asobhana cetasika arise ONLY in akusala citta.
Let me clarify the basics:
1. There are 7 cetasika that are in each and every citta. These are called universals (sabba citta sādhārana)
2. There are six cetasika that also CAN appear in both types of cittā: kusala and akusala. However, they are found in only particular types of cittā. They are called particulars or pakinnaka.
3. There are 14 asobhana cetasika (non-beautiful mental factors) that appear only in akusala citta.
4. There are 25 sobhana cetasika (beautiful mental factors.) They appear only in kusala citta.
5. As a rule, sobhana and asobhana cetasika CANNOT appear together in a given citta.
I just revised the following post on cetasika to make these very clear:
“Cetasika (Mental Factors)”I also revised the post that you quoted to add some subsections to simplify:
“What Are Kilesa (Mental Impurities)? – Connection to Cetasika”What I stated above is in any standard Abhidhamma text. See, for example, Bhikkhu Bodhi’s book, “Comprehensive Manual of Abhidhamma”. See Chapter 2, “Compendium of Mental Factors”
I just came across a post on vipallasa. I had forgotten about it:
“Vipallāsa (Diṭṭhi, Saññā, Citta) Affect Sankhāra“P.S. This post requires revision.
Thank you, Guided!
I think you stated there exactly what the root problem is with these types of meditations.
You wrote: “However, as far as the 10-day introductory course is concerned, there’s not much stress put on this kind anapanasati and instead, one should, I quote, “work with the body, not the mind,” therefore one should disregard ALL thoughts during the meditation itself and focus only on vedana, according to all the assistant teachers I met.”
It is the mind that needs to be purified.
– Our physical body will die within about 100 years.
– However, the “contents of the mind” will be carried to the next life, with its gati, asava, anusaya,, etc.Buddha taught that one should stop ONLY those thoughts that are defiled (immoral or sensual in nature). Those are akusala sankappa and kama sankappa.
– One needs to CULTIVATE moral and non-sensual thoughts. Those are kusala and nekkhamma sankappa.
– Here, “non-sensual” means thoughts that do not involve satisfying especially the taste, smell, and touch. Any thoughts about vision and sounds that are relevant to satisfying taste, smell, and touch need to be avoided too. Some examples are thoughts about food, sex, nice fragrances.In order to set the background, one first needs to realize the unfruitfulness and dangers in engaging in activities/speech/thoughts about sensory pleasures. That is to learn and comprehend Tilakkhana or the anicca, dukkha, anatta nature of this world.
June 13, 2020: I had posted the English translation of a long discourse by Waharaka Thero here. I just removed it since it needs some revision. I will post the revised version when ready.
