[pathfinder]

In this Sermon (Delusion and Illusion), Venerable Amadassana Thero explains that separation is the primary desire of the mind. You can start watching from 1hr 3mins which he gives examples of how separation is pleasurable. One example is that on an empty whiteboard, even when drawing one line it becomes more pleasurable, because now there is separation.

He goes on to explain that the other desires, eg cake, music, paintings, are manifestations of the desire for separation. He gives the simile of a two storey building (1hr 19), where the first story is desire for separation and the second storey are our other, normal desires. The sense of self is also a desire for separation, which the mind desires to be separated from other things. 

However, such separation is an illusion. And it arises because of ignorance. Ignorance of what? Ignorance that the world can be separated. He explains this more clearly in his Illusion of Separation Sermon , (37min 33s) where if you take a cup of ice and a cup of water, and wait for the ice to melt and mix the melted water with the original cup of water, you can differentiate the “ice water”. Likewise, all the structural differences around as are just due to different arrangement of energies (eg water has more energy than ice)

Also, in the  Illusion of Separation Sermon, at 1hr 55s, he explains that the underlying purpose of the mind is to separate. He gives the analogy that you can tell what a person does from his toolbox, eg you can tell that a person is a carpenter by seeing that he has wood sawing tools in his toolbox. Likewise when you see the mind as a tool, what doe sit do? Rupa vedana sanna sankhara vinnana. All this are for purposes of separation.

Hence, the eradication of suffering would be remove the ignorance that the world is not separate. The arahant can still identify objects, the 5 aggregates still happen, however he knows that the truth is that these objects are not separate from each other. (Delusion and Illusion) 2:04:09

I find this very profound, what do yall think? Is this consistent with the tipitaka?

1 user thanked author for this post.

Yash RS

[Lal]

I think we are going off track here. 

• Our suffering arises from our actions based on greed, anger, and ignorance. 
• Since greed and anger/hate arise due to ignorance about the true nature of this world, ignorance is the root cause.
• What is the connection of “separation” with ignorance? Someone, please explain!

[Dawson]

That description, as well as the extent of the emphasis, sounds similar to how a Mahayana Buddhist might describe sunnata and impress that principle upon a person.

If someone had only a couple of minutes to live and their dying wish was to learn about what the Buddha taught, I believe that an ariya would, without hesitation, explain the three characteristics of nature.

If instead they were to explain the principle of separation, I think it’s highly unlikely that the dying person would have a ‘jump out of the bathtub’ eureka moment.

I’m always wary when someone implies that “this is what the Buddha really taught.”

[Lal]

Dawson: “If someone had only a couple of minutes to live and their dying wish was to learn about what the Buddha taught, I believe that an ariya would, without hesitation, explain the three characteristics of nature.”

• Yes. Furthermore, the same principle is embedded in the Four Noble Truths, the three characteristics of nature (Tilakkhana), or Paticca Samuppada.
• They all describe why/how our immoral actions lead to future suffering. The key here is not all actions but immoral actions.
• Puthujjana (average humans, including anyone with even the highest intelligence who has not heard/understood the Four Noble Truths) engage in immoral actions because they are unaware of the Tilakkhana or “true nature of the world” (anicca, dukkha, anatta.) Paticca Samuppada explains how immoral actions (abhisankhara) due to ignorance (avijja) lead to future suffering. It starts with “avijja paccaya (abhi)sankhara” and ends with “jati paccaya jara, marana, soka,…” or the “whole mass of suffering.”
• In the above, anicca nature says all our immoral actions or abhisankhara (believing sensory pleasures can provide lasting happiness) are unfruitful/dangerous. They lead to dukkha or suffering. That is why all such efforts are “devoid of value” and lead to helplessness (when reborn in an apaya), i.e., they are of the anatta nature. That is one way to understand Tilakkhana or the three characteristics of nature.

[Yash RS]

That “seperation” part was about how mind creates a seperate entity as “me” and “others”. Thero was teaching about why there is a perception of a self, as the mind wants seperation, he then proceeded with the things that @pathfinder had written.

I too think that was unnecessary as it doesn’t take us anywhere. It doesn’t tell us how to solve the hidden problem.

[Lal]

Yes. Buddha Dhamma is deep enough. I believe that one should pay more attention to the fact that “sensual pleasures” are a mirage and mind-made. That “distorted sanna” is built into our physical and mental bodies via Paticca Samuppada. I will try to explain that in simpler terms with the new series in the “Meditation” section: “Meditation – Deeper Aspects.”

• It is better not to be distracted by “philosophical sidetracks.” 

1 user thanked author for this post.

Yash RS

[pathfinder]

Thank you everyone. Perhaps Thero came up with this way of explanation to reach out to an audience with less exposure to the dhamma. However, with better understanding of the concepts, we should ultimately focus on interpreting from the tipitaka itself, eg anicca dukkha anatta, 4 noble truths.

[Author]

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