Another proof about Paraloka

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    • #53633
      Jittananto
      Participant

      I came across an interesting sutta that discusses the concept of Paraloka. In it, Lord Buddha states that Paraloka does not exist in Nibbāna. This distinction highlights how Paraloka is separate from the other realms of Samsāra. However, it’s important to note that Paraloka is considered to exist only within the realm of humans and animals.

      Paṭhamanibbānapaṭisaṁyuttasutta

      There is, mendicants, that dimension where there is no earth, no water, no fire, no wind; no dimension of infinite space, no dimension of infinite consciousness, no dimension of nothingness, no dimension of neither perception nor non-perception; no this world, no other world, no moon or sun.

      “Atthi, bhikkhave, tadāyatanaṁ, yattha neva pathavī, na āpo, na tejo, na vāyo, na ākāsānañcāyatanaṁ, na viññāṇañcāyatanaṁ, na ākiñcaññāyatanaṁ, na nevasaññānāsaññāyatanaṁ, nāyaṁ loko, na paraloko, na ubho candimasūriyā.

      There, mendicants, I say there is no coming or going or remaining or passing away or reappearing.

      Tatrāpāhaṁ, bhikkhave, neva āgatiṁ vadāmi, na gatiṁ, na ṭhitiṁ, na cutiṁ, na upapattiṁ;

      It is not established, does not proceed, and has no support.

      appatiṭṭhaṁ, appavattaṁ, anārammaṇamevetaṁ.

      Just this is the end of suffering.”

      Esevanto dukkhassā”ti.

    • #53634
      Lal
      Keymaster

      Hello Jittananto,

      As you point out, this sutta describes Nibbana: There is no earth, no water, no fire, no wind; no dimension of infinite space, no dimension of infinite consciousness, no dimension of nothingness, no dimension of neither perception nor non-perception; no this world, no other world, no moon or sun.

      • Everything except paraloka in the verse describes all the realms associated with the Erath (our cakkavāla).
      • There are billions of other cakkavālās in the universe. All 31 realms are associated with each habitable planetary system (cakkavāla). See #2 of “31 Realms Associated with the Earth.”
      • Thus, paraloka (no other world) means none of those also belong to Nibbana.
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    • #53644
      Jittananto
      Participant

      Thank you for this explanation Sir🙏🏿. The vast majority of  Buddhist think that refers to the others realms like the devas world. They don’t want to accept this concept.

    • #53645
      Lal
      Keymaster

      In other contexts, paraloka could mean different things.

      • When a human dies, the gandhabba comes out and stays in that state for many years until entering another womb. In that case, it is said that the person has gone to paraloka, meaning from the world we can see to “the world of gandhabbas.” This is a somewhat common saying in Sri Lanka.
      • I have also seen moving from the human realm to another realm called “moving to paraloka.” 
      • I have heard the second usage in some English translations but don’t recall the suttas.

       I have not investigated such cases in the suttas. If you come across translations with the above meanings, we can look at them.

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    • #53646
      Jittananto
      Participant

      Sir Lal said: I have not investigated such cases in the suttas. If you come across translations with the above meanings, we can look at them.

      Yes, I will try to find this !

    • #53647
      taryal
      Participant

      And here is the empirical proof of paraloka. It appears that this is as close as we can get to understanding paraloka using the “mundane” approach (i.e. without jhana):

       

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    • #53648
      Lal
      Keymaster

      Yes, Taryal. That is an example of the following interpretation of “paraloka” I stated above:

      “When a human dies, the gandhabba comes out and stays in that state for many years until entering another womb. In that case, it is said that the person has gone to paraloka, meaning from the world we can see to “the world of gandhabbas.” This is a somewhat common saying in Sri Lanka.”

      • In the case discussed in the video, gandhabba went to “paraloka” for a short time and came back to the same body.
      • This reply was modified 1 week ago by Lal.
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    • #53664
      Lal
      Keymaster

      In a comment above, I wrote: 

      “In other contexts, paraloka could mean different things.

      • When a human dies, the gandhabba comes out and stays in that state for many years until entering another womb. In that case, it is said that the person has gone to paraloka, meaning from the world we can see to “the world of gandhabbas.” This is a somewhat common saying in Sri Lanka.”

      The following sutta gives an example of this usage:Mogharājamāṇavapucchā (Snp 5.16).”

      Ayaṁ loko paro loko, brahmaloko sadevako; Diṭṭhiṁ te nābhijānātigotamassa yasassino.” OR

      Regarding this world, the other world, and the realms of Brahmas and Devas, I’m not familiar with that worldview of the renowned Gotama.”

      • The first two refer to the human realm (with a physical body and “the other world” referring to the gandhabba state).
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      • #53671
        Jittananto
        Participant

        Thank you for this proof, Sir🙏🏿 I wonder why the majority of buddhist doesn’t want to accept this despite the proof. 

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