At the beginning of this thread Pathfinder wrote the following:
“I think it is important to analyse on the validity of the tipitaka itself to build faith in the dhamma.We have been referencing the tipitaka, and whenever we do so we have the following assumptions:
- Whatever is stated in the tipitaka is factually right, though not for word, the events did happen, and they are words of the Buddha himself, and they are not made up by anyone else.
- The words of the Buddha are true, the Buddha did not make them up.”
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1. Using that approach, one will NEVER make any progress toward verifying the validity of the Tipitaka (i.e., Buddha’s teachings).
- The reason is simple: Buddha’s teachings cannot be verified within any theories or arguments based on human knowledge.
- Understanding Buddha Dhamma requires a “paradigm change.”
2. The Buddha stated the above using the verse, “adhigato kho myāyaṁ dhammo gambhīro duddaso duranubodho santo paṇīto atakkāvacaro nipuṇo paṇḍitavedanīyo.”
- Soon after attaining the Buddhahood, the Buddha uttered that verse: “Brahmāyācana Sutta (SN 6.1).”
- The translation is that link: “This principle I have discovered is deep, hard to see, hard to understand, peaceful, sublime, beyond the scope of logic, subtle, comprehensible to the astute.”
- There, “adhigato kho myāyaṁ dhammo” means “This Dhamma that I uncovered.” “gambhīro” means “profound.” The rest of the translations are good, but “atakkāvacaro” does not mean “beyond the scope of logic.”
- “Atakkāvacaro” means “beyond the scope of the logic of the humans or the world in general.”
3. That is why Pathfinder’s proposed scheme will not work.
- The validity of Buddha Dhamma cannot be tested within the theories or logic known to humans. It requires a paradigm change in thinking.
- All philosophies and religions are based on the assumption that happiness can be achieved somewhere within this world, whether in this life or a “heavenly realm.”
- Buddha taught that the above assumption is wrong. One can eliminate sakkaya ditthi only by seeing that it is indeed true.
4. That verse “adhigato kho myāyaṁ dhammo gambhīro duddaso duranubodho santo paṇīto atakkāvacaro nipuṇo paṇḍitavedanīyo” appears in many suttas, including DN 1, DN 14, MN 26, MN 72, MN 95.
- In the “Brahmāyācana Sutta (SN 6.1)” the Buddha explained why it is difficult for average humans (puthujjana) to see the validity of his teachings.
- starting at marker 1.5, he explains why. That verse is better translated as, “But people like clinging to sensory pleasures, they love it and enjoy it.”
- @ marker 1.6: “It’s hard for them to see the truth, i.e., idappaccayatā paṭicca samuppāda.
- @ marker 4.1; “And as the Buddha reflected like this, his mind inclined not to teach the Dhamma to the world.” Of course, that was not going to happen. He strived for the Buddhahood for the sake of himself and others. Even though the sutta states he accepted Brahmā Sahampati’s invitation to teach Dhamma, that was a formality. He had an obligation to help others, which he started doing soon afterward: “Animisa Lōcana Bōdhi Poojā – A Prelude to Acts of Gratitude.”
5. This is why engaging in debates with those with wrong views is futile.
- The only way to eliminate wrong views is to examine Buddha’s teachings with an open mind.
- Each individual must decide whether or not to take that approach.
- Engaging in debates on this issue is a waste of time.
