Reply To: Understanding of Anicca

#50031
Lal
Keymaster

Pathfinder:“I agree that the opposite of icca is anicca, hence opposite of desire = not desired. However, icca itself did not have an aspect of time. Why are we adding this “long run” aspect to anicca, and where is the element of time stated in the line of “Yam pi iccam…”? Why not just see everything as undesireable in the first place without taking into account time?”

  • There are many instances where one can fulfill one’s expectations in the short term. For example, suppose one wants to become wealthy by selling drugs. They can become successful and become rich. In some cases, they may even avoid getting caught until death. It seems that they got their desire fulfilled. However, they will pay for the damage done to ruin many lives in the future. So, being able to live a luxurious life for even 50 years will be minuscule if reborn as an animal or worse due to that immoral actions of selling drugs.
  • The same applies to the next few verses quoted. Kamma vipaka may take time to materialize.

Pathfinder: “The first question was, “Bhikkhus: is any rūpaniccaor anicca?” or “Bhikkhus: can any rūpa be kept to one’s satisfaction or cannot be kept to one’s satisfaction?”

Here, based on the earlier arguments, it does not have to be that rūpa be kept to one’s satisfaction, but we can just interpret as “Bikkhus, are rupa liked or disliked in nature?” This will still be consisent with the rest of the sutta.”

  • Yes. That is fine. Nothing in this world can be kept as one desires.

Regarding the last part of your comment:

  • Yes. There are many ways to understand the meaning of anicca. Different (but still related) meanings “sink in” to the mind of different people.
  • The bottom line is this: We engage in various actions, hoping they will lead to happiness in the long run. But nothing in this world can provide that. This idea can be tested at various time scales. It may seem to work in some or even many cases (you study for an examination and pass with the highest grades, for example), but in the long run (through the rebirth process), such “wins” do not make much difference. 
  • Temptations (based on “distorted sanna“) are extremely powerful. We all have read about how “highly-moral people” can succumb to temptations and take bribes, steal, kill, rape, etc. One can try to live a moral life, but without grasping the “anicca nature” and becoming a Sotapanna, it would be impossible to avoid some temptations.