Reply To: Difference between "Arahant phala samapatti" and "Nirodha samapatti" ?


I had missed the comment by y not because he had posted while I was replying to the comment by cubibobi.

Y not wrote: “In life we see that we can enjoy the pleasant, but have to pay for that by experiencing the unpleasant as well. It is the two sides of a coin. You must accept the unpleasant in order to have the pleasant. Nibbana would here equate with rejecting both – throwing away the coin. Free of the unpleasant, yes, but at the price of giving up on the pleasant.”

Mostly correct. But samsaric suffering and any trace of happiness (even if in a Brahma realm for millions of years) cannot be equated as “two sides of a coin“. This is the point to contemplate on. That Brahma will come down to the human realm and will succumb to temptations and WILL BE born in an apaya at some point. Even a few days of suffering in some apayas will be unbearable.

There are many suttas in Samyutta Nikāya 56 that describe the dangers for living-beings trapped in the rebirth process. See, for example, suttas starting with “SN 56.35 A Hundred Spears

Here is a brief summary of the sutta SN 56.35 in my words:
“Bhikkhus, suppose there is a man with a life span of a hundred years. Someone would say to him: “You will be guaranteed of getting to the Arahanthood if you agree to be pierced by a spear three times a day for the hundred years of your life.”
Bhikkhus, he should accept the offer. For what reason? Because this rebirth process is filled with unimaginable suffering.
Even though that may be so, bhikkhus, I do not say that path to the Arahanthood is filled with suffering or displeasure. Rather, the Noble Path is accompanied only by happiness and joy.
Bhikkhus, you need to understand: ‘This rebirth process is filled with unimaginable suffering. The Noble Path is the way leading to the cessation of all that suffering.’

Many people are misled by the term “Nibbanic bliss” thinking that it is a vedana to be FELT. As I have explained in the post on Nibbana in my earlier post, we CANNOT express what Nibbana is like (after the Parinibbana of an Arahant). Because NOTHING of this world (including feelings, perceptions, thoughts, etc) are in Nibbana.
– However, there are instances in the Tipitaka where new Arahants utter joyous verses expressing the “bliss.”
– That can be compared to what one feels when one had just gotten rid of a chronic headache that one had for the whole lifetime. Imagine the relief! That is not a “sukha vedana” but just the absence of a piercing dukkha vedana.
– But no one can express the status of an Arahant AFTER the death of his/her physical body.
– But that lifestream WILL NOT be subjected to even a trace of suffering FOREVER. That is all we can say.