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Added part 7 of the Series to Janith Fernando’s transcriptions of Waharaka Thero’s Desanas listed in my post on June 19, 2020, above.
Yes. There is a sutta that describes such instructions by Ven. Sariputta to someone at deathbed. I am not sure whether that is to Anathapindika.
– I think Anathapindika was reborn in a Deva realm.
– In the relevant sutta, Ven. Sariputta directed the mind of a dying person to higher and higher Brahma realms progressively. That person was reborn in a Brahma realm.But that would be possible ONLY IF the dying person has accrued enough merits.
– Some other kamma vipaka could have been blocking him from “accessing” a higher Brahama realm.Unless one has accrued the necessary merits, even a Buddha cannot help anyone.
– Otherwise, the Buddha would have “saved” everyone from rebirth in apayas.1 user thanked author for this post.
One may be able to look at a given word in different ways.
But pāpa means the opposite of puñña.
– A pāpa kamma is a highly-immoral kamma that will lead to rebirth in an apaya.
– A puñña kamma will lead to rebirth in good realms.
– See the post referred to in my first comment above.The Buddha and his disciples called the Māra Devaputta pāpi Māra” or pāpima“because the Māra Devaputta encourages people to stay in kama loka.
See, for example, “Māratajjanīya Sutta (MN 50)”
– From the two translations there, the following is a bit better: “Discourse On A Rebuke To Māra”Pāpa kamma discussed in, “Mahāli Sutta (AN 10.47)” for example.
Yes. The Buddha Sāsana will end in about 2500 years in the HUMNA WORLD.
However, there will be Ariyas (Noble Persons) in higher realms for much longer.
– In particular, there can be Brahmas in higher realms who are Anagamis for many eons.
– For example, Sahampati Brahma told Buddha Gotama that he attained the Anagami stage many eons ago when he learned Dhamma from a different Buddha. As we remember from “Buddhism and Evolution – Aggañña Sutta (DN 27)” post, higher-lying Brahma realms are not destroyed in a “loka vināsa“, i.e., when the Earth blows up and destroyed.
– Sahampati Brahma says he listened to several Buddhas after attaining the Anagami stage and born in that realm.So, to Johnny’s question: “can there be any Sakadāgāmi devas leftover from Kassapa Buddha’s dhamma era when Gautama Buddha appeared on earth?”
– Yes. That is possible. But such Devas are not born in the human world and thus cannot bring Buddha Sāsana to the human world. In other words, a Sakadāgāmi deva who attained that during the previous Buddha (Buddha Kassapa) would not be born in the human world AFTER the end of Buddha Kassapa’s Sasana. Only another Buddha (in this case Buddha Gotama) can bring Buddha Dhamma to the humans after that.Yes. You are correct.
There are many different interpretations of the term “papañcasaññāsaṅkhā.”Here is a comment in a discussion forum that I came across when searching for that term.
“MN 18 is a very good example but this might be against the view of a dvanda compound and might support my considering of a tappurisa compound. Below translations of the compound papañcasaññāsaṅkhā:
Yatonidānaṃ, bhikkhu, purisaṃ papañcasaññāsaṅkhā samudācaranti
Mendicant, a person is beset by concepts of identity that emerge from the proliferation of perceptions. – Sujato
the origin of the number (saṅkhā) of perceptions and obsessions which assail a man – Horner
the source, perceptions and notions [born of] mental proliferation beset a man – Bodhi
the perceptions & categories of objectification assail him/her – Thanissaro”
The quote is from, “Re: Is Papanca commentary, identification or both?”
So, yes, there is a lot of confusion about translating some Pali words.
– I have explained my translation of papañca. It is up to each person to scrutinize and see which translation is correct.
– Of course, one needs to look at many different suttas to whether a given translation is consistent with other suttas.
– papañcasaññāsaṅkhā needs a lot of explanation. I will need to write a post to explain it. Hopefully, I will be able to do that in the near future.However, I think it is important to understand the meaning of papañca. I have explained it in my previous post above.
Hello Grenier!
It is not correct to translate “papañca” as “”making manifold.”
Papañca means to be “blinded by sensual pleasures” and to engage in highly-immoral deeds. One who engages in such thoughts, speech, and actions is bound to be reborn in the four lowest realms (apāyā.)
This is discussed, for example, in the “Madhupiṇḍika Sutta (MN 18)“.
For example, the following is a key verse there: “yatonidānaṃ, bhikkhu, purisaṃ papañcasaññāsaṅkhā samudācaranti. Ettha ce natthi abhinanditabbaṃ abhivaditabbaṃ ajjhositabbaṃ. Esevanto rāgānusayānaṃ … pe … etthete pāpakā akusalā dhammā aparisesā nirujjhantī’ti..”
Papañca is thus related to pāpa kammā. See #13 of the post, “Kusala and Akusala Kamma, Puñña and Pāpa Kamma”
– It is a good idea to read that post to get a good idea about the words, kusala/akusala kamma and puñña/pāpa kamma.I don’t disagree with many things you stated, Chah.
Different people become passionate about different issues. I can understand your passion for animal lives.
– But we all are forced to engage in unfruitful or undesirable actions at various levels. That is what I was trying to say. If one gets to the level of abstaining eating meat, one needs to be abstaining from all four types of wrong speech, because that affects other humans and thus would incur much more strong kamma. You could be at that level. I do not know. But I know most people are not.
– Only an Arahant is completely free of dasa akusala.
– There is absolutely nothing wrong with abstaining from eating meat. In fact, that should be commended.
– If we can scrutinize all our actions to that level, that will definitely speed up the process of attaining Nibbana.Welcome to the forum, Chah!
You wrote, “With regards to the title, can we agree that the taking of life (for any purpose, but in particular for the purpose of the enjoyment of the taste of flesh) is an evil action?”
Yes. No one said otherwise. Taking a life is an evil action.
– But someone buying meat at the supermarket is not taking a life. That animal was killed by someone else days ago.Now, there are some minor related issues. Those could become major issues depending on the “spiritual level” of the person.
– Some people say that if people stop eating meat, that animal would not have been killed.
– That is true, but that is why I said my statement is not to condone eating meat.
– Some people (especially meditators) do not eat meat due to that way of thinking, and that is great.But as you pointed out, the Buddha did not want to “make a rule out of it” even for the bhikkhus. But bhikkhus are not supposed to accept a meal if an animal was killed for just that meal (i.e., if a chicken was killed for the meal, for example).
The main point is that most of our actions involve hurting other living beings in some way. It is virtually impossible to live without doing harm to other living beings.
– Even when we walk, we inadvertently kill so many small creatures.
– The water we drink has so many microscopic creatures.
– When we clean the house, we inadvertently kill many living beings.
– Furthermore, if we push your argument a bit more, eating rice or any other food would be bad too. How many animals are killed by farmers when they grow any kind of food? An uncountable number of living-beings are killed when a farmer prepares the soil for planting, and even when harvesting the crop.It is a good idea to examine the relative strengths of such inadvertent actions versus some other actions we may not think about.
– The “level of existence” or the “level of consciousness” plays a large role in the strength of a kamma. A human life is much more valuable than animal life. Even among humans, hurting one will magga phala would have much larger consequences. For example, killing an Arahant is an anantariya kamma, a much more potent kamma than killing an average human.
– Even verbally hurting another HUMAN is much worse than deliberately killing many small animals.
– Some of these discussed in, “How to Evaluate Weights of Different Kamma”This and related issues were discussed at the forum several times in the past. The following is one: “Abstaining from damaging plants and seeds”
I was thinking about what cubibobi asked: “Is “Mara” as designation of this deva the same word “mara” as in relating to death?”
Yes. There is also a connection of Māra to death or “marana” in the following sense.
In Ariya Vinaya, death is inevitably “attached” to birth (jāti). Wherever there is birth, there will ALWAYS be death.
– Therefore, in Ariya Vinaya (i.e., for Noble Persons) whatever causes the birth-death cycle to continue is the REAL death or “marana.”
– Now, those who do not realize the drawbacks and dangers in kāma (sense pleasures) are going to be subjected to the rebirth process or “marana”
– That is why Māra Devaputta is associated with marana. He encourages people to enjoy sense pleasures, even though he discourages immoral behavior. But as long as one does not realize the bad consequences and dangers in engaging in even harmless sense pleasures, one will NOT be able to escape the “kāma loka“. As long as one is in kāma loka, the possibility of succumbing to temptations and ending up in the apāyā will be there (until one becomes a Sotapanna/Sotapanna Anugāmi)
– That is why the Buddha always referred to Māra Devaputta as a “bad influence” and equated to “death”. That death or “marana” means the inability to reach release from the cycle of suffering.It is a bit deeper point. Please feel free to ask questions.
The Pāli word for death is “marana“.
However, I should have mentioned that “Māra” could have one of two meanings, depending on the context.
– One is Māra Devaputta, a Deva, who gave a lot of trouble to the Buddha because he was against people attaining Nibbana. His mindset is as follows: “Deva realms are so blissful. People should engage in good deeds and get rebirth in Deva realms.” He does not understand that he himself could be born in an apāya in the future.
– The other Māra is the “kilesa māra” referring to the defilements in a person’s mind. Those are temptations to engage in sensual pleasures. I think you could be referring to this second usage.
Yes. These are common issues for many people.
I just wrote a lengthy explanation for related issues on a different topic: “Mediumship is it real?”
It may seem that it is a different topic. But the second question he asked was on the current topic. So, please read my comment at July 18, 2020, at 5:07 pm.
Most of the problems that we face are of our own making.
– It is hard to believe, but all these problems go away when we work on purifying the mind.Here are two posts that I wrote several years ago that address this issue from a different perspective: “Foundation of Dhamma” and “The Importance of Purifying the Mind“
Raja asked, “if anger is a facet of greed, is fear too?”
Yes. Anger is a facet of greed.
– Fear is the RESULT of anger.Think about it this way.
– When we hurt someone by verbally threatening or even physically injuring another person, we generate a form of fear in that person.
– That mindest (technically called sankhara) in our mind, leads to fuel an existence (bhava) corresponding to that sankhara. Now, this “bhava” is NOT a “bhava” for rebirth, but an existence within a life.Generation of greed in the mind (greedy sankhara) can lead to a “peta bhava” within this life in the same way.
In both cases, the Paticca Samuppada process proceeds in the standard way: “avijja paccaya sankhara” through “bhava paccaya jati“, “jati paccaya jara, marana, soka, etc” or SUFFERING.
This is the “Idappaccayātā Paṭicca Samuppāda” process.
Now, if one keeps engaging in that kind of behavior, the kammic energy can grow and could lead to a birth in a bad existence.
– That is the “Akusala-Mūla Uppatti Paṭicca Samuppāda” process.A more detailed analysis at, “Paṭicca Samuppāda in Plain English”
The main point is that we prepare our own futures (whether in this life or in future lives) by thinking, speaking, and doing things in certain ways. As mentioned above, those are sankhara. For details, see, “Saṅkhāra – What It Really Means”
– Those on the “good side” lead to “good results.’
– Those on the “bad side” lead to “bad results”.As cubibobi suggested, it is a good idea to review AND follow the guidelines in the initial posts of the section, “Bhāvanā (Meditation)”
– That provides the necessary background to comprehend and fully understand the Paticca Samuppada processes.
– Learning Dhamma is to learn Paticca Samuppada, how we create our own futures.Some of the links above may be somewhat advanced. I would suggest starting with the “Bhāvanā (Meditation)” section.
P.S. Please start a new topic if the new question is not related to the previous question.
For those who are not familiar with the term, “Mediumship” or just “Medium”, it refers to an instance where a subtle-body of another living being (could even be a human gandhabba) enters the physical body of a human and “takes possession” of that human body.
– There is truth to this mechanism. However, most current accounts are fake.During the “time of possession,” it is the alien being who is in control of the physical body.
– In reality, this can only happen to those with “weak minds.”
– Those of us who follow Buddha Dhamma do not need to worry about it.
– Even more importantly, it is better to just ignore such occurrences, whether real or not. It would not be helpful to get involved.In the 1990 movie “Ghost,” Oda May is a medium (or a psychic.) See, “Ghost 1990 Movie – Good Depiction of Gandhabba Concept”
P.S. For more information, see, “Mental Body (Gandhabba) – Personal Accounts” and “What Does Buddha Dhamma Say about Creator, Satan, Angels, and Demons?”
P.S. Usually, a psychic or a “medium” is a person who has a relationship with another living-being of “subtle form” and, thus, can invite that being to “take possession” of one’s own body. That is what Oda May in the movie “Ghost” does.
– I don’t want to get into too many details, but that completes the above description.That explanation does give the right idea, y not.
However, the word dhamma should not be attributed to Vedic teachings. It has origins in the previous Buddha, Buddha Kassapa (and, of course, to even earlier Buddhas). All Buddhas teach the same Buddha Dhamma.
I have touched on that in several posts. I mentioned that again in #5 in the introduction to the new series of posts “Buddhahood Controversies – Introduction.”
– I will write more on that in upcoming posts in that series.Dhamma means “to bear.”
– Everything in this world arises due to dhammā (created by the mind.) Buddha’s teachings about how that happens is called “Buddha Dhamma.” See, “Dhammā, Kamma, Saṅkhāra, Mind – Critical Connections.”– More clarification at, “Ye Dhammā Hetuppabhavā.. and Yam Kiñci Samudaya Dhammam..“
Good question, because this gets to the heart of Buddha Dhamma.
The Buddha addressed the issue of future-suffering in the rebirth process.
– Each living being is born only to go through aging, sickness, and eventual death. But it does not end there.
– That living being is born again, only to got through the same process of aging, sickness, and death.
– Furthermore, most births in that rebirth process are in the four lowest realms (apayas) of animal, hungry ghost, asura, and hell. We tend to think of “birth’ as “birth as a human.” But in the rebirth process, human birth is very hard to get.That is called “suffering associated with the rebirth process” or “samsaric dukkha.”
– The only way to end that suffering is to stop the rebirth process, i.e., to attain Nibbana.The Buddha realized the “hidden suffering” in the rebirth process when he saw the “Four Great Omens” as a young Prince. See, “Buddhahood Controversies – Introduction“
