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The following comment is by Tobias:
I still cannot post. What is meant by the word kasina? Sutta Central says: all, whole, entire.Sorry to hear that, Tobias. Try a different browser if possible.
The word “kasina” has roots in “khīṇa” or “to wear away.” It is used in the mundane sense by ancient yogis and also in the lokottara sense in Buddha Dhamma.
1. The yogis had realized that keeping one’s mind away from sensual pleasures will lead to the “wearing away of the tendency to attach to sensual pleasures” and thus to get into jhana.
– So, they used inert “kasina objects” to keep the mind focused on non-sensual arammana and were able to get into jhanas.
– In a way, “breath meditation” is a form of kasina mediation using air as a “kasina object.”2. In Buddha Dhamma “wearing away of defilements” is done on a permanent basis using insight meditation (by cultivating wisdom or paññā).
– A special case is to contemplate the true nature pathavi, apo, tejo, vayo, and that is in the two suttas mentioned earlier.It would take a post to expand on that. I just don’t have time right now.
The following discourse by Waharaka Thero also explains the above briefly:
“කසින භාවනා සහ දුතාංග“Yes. There is a kasina mediation in Buddha Dhamma.
– It DOES NOT use kasina objects.More details on Buddhist kasina mediation in the “Mahārāhulovāda Sutta (MN 62)”.
– “Mahārāhulovāda Sutta (MN 62) – With English Translation at Sutta Central”I have not read the English translations of both suttas. So, I don’t know how accurate they are.
– But if there is any mention of kasina objects, please point that out. I can take a look.Your post is fine, Lang. Good explanation.
– I did not see a link on Niramisa sukha. Don’t worry about it.” I’m dead AND in full Nibbana so why am I called an Arahant and the Buddha is called a Buddha?”
What does that even mean? After Paribbana, there is no Buddha or an Arahant!
– These days we refer to a Buddha who lived 2600 years ago. He is not there (in this world) anymore. But there lived a Buddha and there lived many Arahants within the past 2600 years.This is why I say this type of questioning doesn’t go anywhere. After all this discussion, you have not understood what is meant by Nibbana/Parinibbana.
This reminds me of the never-ending discussion at the Dhamma Wheel discussion forum on Nibbana:
“the great Nibbana = annihilation, eternal, or something else thread”
– Those people who have made comments on that thread have no basic understanding of Buddha Dhamma. It is funny (and saddening at the same time) to read some of those comments.The answer to that is a bit deeper.
Nibbana is attained by removing the ten “bonds” to this world (samyojana).
Breaking those bonds is done while one lives human life, whether as a Bodhisatta or just a normal person. A Bodhisatta learns the way by himself. All others follow that path found by a Bodhisatta.
– Not all humans are the same. They have flaws. A Bodhisatta (who has made preparations for the attainment of the Buddhahood over an unimaginable time) would have fewer flaws than most other humans. Each person’s current life (health, wealth, etc.) depends on past causes. But as long as one can cultivate sufficient wisdom (panna) by learning Dhamma, one would be able to break those “samsaric bonds”.
– But in the end, once those bonds are broken, they all achieve the same goal, i.e., not be reborn in any of the 31 realms. That is what Nibbana is.It may be a good idea to read the following post regarding Bodhisattas:
“Pāramitā and Niyata Vivarana – Myths or Realities?”Eventually, answers to questions of this type require a bit more advancement on the eightfold path.
– I am not trying to evade questions. But the point is that no matter how intelligent a person is, that does not count much towards making progress in learning Buddha Dhamma unless one understands the basic concepts. I have some friends who are scientists but are not able to understand some concepts. I hope you are different. You are at least curious. Some of those friends of mine do not show any interest. They are too busy!Hello Brett,
The Buddha or any Ararahnt would not have even a trace of “defilements” (greed, hate/anger/ignorance) left in their minds.
– However, Arahants may have some leftover habits that some people may consider unsuitable for an Arahant. There are some accounts of that in the Tipitaka. Once a young Arahant was walking with a layperson and they came across a mud puddle on the road. The young Arahant jumped over the puddle and the layperson immediately thought, “Oh, this bhikkhu cannot be an Arahant.” It turned out that the young Arahant had been born a monkey in the recent past. It was a “harmless habit” of his to jump over things at times.
– A Buddha would not have even such minor “character flaws.”However, upon Parinibbana, Buddha or an Arahant attains the same Nibbana.
Brett had asked earlier a question that I just saw: “I also do not understand you saying there is no soul but at the same going on describing the lifestream exactly the way I think of the soul. Perhaps were you referring to the idea of many that their soul is their personality reborn?”
The difference is as follows:
– A soul is usually defined as “the spiritual or immaterial part of a human being or animal, regarded as immortal.”– But a lifestream is NOT immortal. It ends at the Parinibbana as an Arahant.
Brett wrote: “Obviously (full) Nibbana implies no matter and it does not exist either, at least in the original sense of the word “to exist”. Exist comes from the Latin root ex (forth) and Sistere (caused to stand), thus existence is to emerge, to come out.. ”
The main point to understand is that “exist” as you defined above is defined with the nomenclature of “this world of 31 realms.”
– Such words cannot describe ANYTHING to define Nibbana.
– Nibbana and “this world of 31 realms” are mutually exclusive.The main point to understand is that suffering will not go away within the rebirth process (keep “coming back” to this world of 31 realms.)
– Suffering stops when that process is stopped.
– That is what Cubibobi referred to as “burdened with a FUTURE body.” A “future body” just means a rebirth.When one attains a perfectly purified mind that leads to BOTH types of Nibbana.
P.S. Thaks for the comments, Lang.
More information on that (citta, cetasika, rupa, Nibbana) at, “The Grand Unified Theory of Dhammā – Introduction“That is what I explained above with “saupadisesa Nibbana” and “anupadisesa Nibbana.”
A living Arahant would have a purified mind. He/she still lives in this world with a purified mind.
– At the death of the physical body (Parinibbana or “full Nibbana“) that lifestream will cease to exist in this suffering-filled world.That last part is hard to understand for most people. They evaluate things based on the human experience, which may not appear to be “filled with suffering.”
– But human existence is very short in the rebirth process. Most births are in the four lowest realms (apayas) filled with suffering.Where do I say something to the effect for you to say: “The way it is stated one reads that there is a mind before and after.”?
There is no contradiction. After the death of an Arahant, there is no mind, no hadaya vatthu.
The mind (and hadaya vatthu) are associated with “this world of 31 realms.”
Nibbana does not belong to this world of 31 realms. As long as existence continues in this world, suffering does not end.
I have explained that in many posts:
“Nibbāna“You are right, Tobias. There is only one dhammatā, which is dhammaniyāmatā. The sutta you referenced explains that.
It seems that the five “five dhammatā” was made up by someone in a commentary. It could be Visuddhimagga, but I am not sure.
– If a key principle is not referenced in the Tipitaka, it is safe to assume that it was made up by someone at a later time.I had come across a discourse by Waharaka Thero which addresses this issue about the “five dhammatā“. For the benefit of those who can understand the Sinhala language here is the link:
“කර්මය, නියාම ධර්ම”
– Explanation within the first 30 minutes.
