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I guess it is possible, but it seems unlikely to me.
- A Sotapanna can be reborn in the human realm and still have the kama-raga samyojana. So, it cannot be ruled out.
- In any case, a raja-cakkavatthi (an emperor who controls all the countries in the world) is rarely born.
Thank you for the answer sir.
Hello, venerable Lal sir. I understand that reward of stream-entry is supreme and excels everything, so I have a strange question which I forgot to ask earlier, is it possible for an ariya to be raja-cakkavatthi? It is fine if you don’t answer it. I understand if any answer could create further confusion, it is better to not give it. Thank you.
A whole series of suttas, starting with the “Cakkavattirāja Sutta (SN 55.1)“, states so. One can read the whole series to confirm.
I am gonna read it.
However, it is not easy to attain, because for most people it is hard even to accept that sensory pleasures are mirages.
As far as I understand, one actually have to work for it even waging one’s life, only then it is attained. I mean that level of wise and serious efforts are required, I think.
It would be better if you comment on a specific post in the “Questions About Puredhamma Posts” thread. The “General Forum” is for general comments and questions on any topic.
Yes sir, I will keep this in mind from now on. Post related comments in “Questions About Puredhamma Posts” thread.
Don’t worry if you don’t really understand that. It will become clear later.
yes sir. I am over speculating I guess. I tried to read (or reread) the relevant posts but they are vast, it will take time.
However, in the long run, all puthujjana (in any realm, including the Deva and Brahma realms) are mostly reborn in the apayas. That is when the dukkha vedana becomes unbearable. This is why attaining the Sotapanna stage is critical.
yes sir. I understand this above part to some extent. The dukkha is main thing. I have read about various hells, their descriptions, various causes which cause one to take birth there. That is when I started feeling urgency and felt that, only attaining sotapanna must be most important thing in life, everything else is secondary. Even right now I am getting goosebumps and fear as I read the word ‘apayas’. You are right sir, this is most serious thing many people ignore. The urgency is real. Thankfully I am fortunate to have this fear. I also feel that my parents, family and other close people are also subject to this, being puthujjanas. I am sure 100% they are not sotapanna. And this realization is ultimately worrying for me. But until and unless I make myself secure and free from lower realms forever, I can never hope to help them, ever. Thankfully my good kamma allowed me to have this urgency and fear.
I plan to discuss that in detail in upcoming posts. This is why ‘uccheda ditthi‘ (the wrong view that there is no rebirth process) is the most dangerous.
It would be really good sir! I actually had the ‘sassata ditthi’ very strongly. I mean I knew about impermanence (which is wrong translation of ‘anicca’) but I never gave any attention to it or became serious about it. But not anymore.
I understand one thing, going to the middle from ‘sassata ditthi’ is comparatively less difficult than going to the middle from ‘uccheda ditthi’. Really it is very needed to understand how one with ‘uccheda ditthi’ is at worse state than one with ‘sassata ditthi’. One with sassata ditthi can at least try to see the issue and try to understand why his view could be problem, but the one with uccheda ditthi could be like, blindly going downwards, never bothering even to try.
Yes. A puthujjana does not have any of the ‘five faculties’ of ‘pañca Indriya‘, which are needed to cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna.
So basically puthujjana is automated virtual game character, who is having no self but a ultimate belief that he has self, and keeps on suffering. Doesn’t even have the faculties to get out of this mess. Makes sense.
No. “Pure Abodes” (Suddhāvāsa) are the five highest realms of the rūpa loka reserved for Anāgāmis.
Satipaṭṭhāna Bhūmi can be accessed by a living Sotāpanna (or any Noble Person) after cultivating Satipaṭṭhāna.
The mind of a puthujjana is always covered by panca nivarana, and therefore, it cannot ‘think clearly’ and thus cannot engage in Vipassanā. Even the mind of a Sotāpanna who has not cultivated Satipaṭṭhāna is covered by panca nivarana.Understood sir.
Thus, reaching the Arahant stage can be called ‘Parinibbana‘.
oh, got it. So this is why anagami is roughly translated as ‘non-returner’, whereas arahant is sometimes translated as ‘Thus gone one’, as he is gone already the moment he became arahant. In any case I got it.
Thus, we can ‘reach’ (and communicate with) an Arahant until their physical body dies.
However, once the physical body dies, an Arahant does not/cannot ‘come back to this world’. They are separated from the suffering-filled world forever.The last sentence above is heart-breaking as well as thrilling. I felt piti reading the last sentence. So nibbana must be really good, that is why it is valued above all.
It just means that, one should value ariyas, because as long as one is puthujjana, one will meet puthujjanas again and again, but once ariya is gone (attained parinibbana), they are gone forever.
So when you said, that ‘They are separated from the suffering-filled world forever’, does that mean, they could be anywhere where there is no suffering? Off course, it is not possible to imagine a world which is free from suffering. But I believe it is beyond 31 realms of existence.
I also imagine that happiness of nibbana must be really highest and purest (param) and it must be higher than what any highest happiness found in 31 realms. But I am saying all this through faith and understanding, not through experience.
(ii) The death of an Arahant is also called ‘Parinibbana‘. But only the physical body dies at that point. The ‘mental body’ had attained ‘Parinibbana‘ at the moment of attaining the Arahant stage.
So, death is not a big deal for an arahant (instead it is relief I guess), it is just big deal for those are still living in 31 realms as they will not be able to see that arahant ever. In other words, this transition, being able to contact arahant and then not being able to contact him, is only for puthujjanas or any one who is still within 31 realms of existence. For arahant, he was already gone when he became arahant.
Sir, by ‘mental body’ are you referring to ‘citta’? Also, what is the difference between citta and mind?
sadhu sadhu sadhu brother!
I don’t know how to address this. Congrats very much, I guess, and I wish you achieve what you are ordaining for.
All the best!2 users thanked author for this post.
No. That is not what I meant.
The difficulty for me was to sort out the correct teachings of Buddha. These days, different people have different interpretations that have evolved (‘devolved’ is the better word) over the past two thousand years.yes yes, understood sir. Also I agree that ‘devolved’ is the better word.
It was Wharaka Thero who started the process of uncovering the correct teachings of the Buddha. Only a ‘jati Sotapanna‘ (who had attained the Sotapanna stage in a previous life) can do that with the help of the Tipitaka books written over two thousand years ago. He would have uncovered more if he had not passed away in 2017. We should all be grateful to him, and also do our best to keep making progress.
I am also grateful to ven. waharaka thero then. 🙏🙏🙏
1. It took me over fifteen years of daily contemplation to get to this point. But as the Buddha stated, his teachings are deeper than anyone can imagine. He said he only taught a fraction of what he realized!
So basically, we cannot imagine/fathom what all lord buddha had realized.
The main problem, as I see it, is that most people don’t know where to get started. Many meditation programs teach ‘Vipassana‘, but even the teachers are not even Sotapannas.
One must be a Sotapanna even to start cultivating Satipatthana, and that must be done before that Sotapanna can start engaging in Vipassana! Engaging in Vipassana is the same as cultivating Satta Bojjhanga.I never seem to be able to disagree with you ven. Lal sir. That is really true. We have expert puthujjanas. But there is no solution for that, is there? I always believed that ariyas/noble beings are very rare, and it is also not easy to recognize them.
Paticca Samuppada says one extends the rebirth process each time one initiates a Paticca Samuppada process with the belief that experience (at that moment) is real.
This is why that process (and the rebirth process itself) can also be stopped within a short time. Venerable Bahiya stopped the rebirth process (i.e., became an Arahant) within an hour! Angulimala attained the Sotapanna stage within an hour after killing almost a thousand people.Wow, this is really thought provoking for me. So it is already happening, even now as I am typing this message or doing any of my work, the process of Paticca Samuppada process is ongoing, is that it? So the underlying cause which continues it is the hidden deeply integrated belief that the current experience is real!? Now that I am trying to understand it, it really makes sense how people like angulimala, even though being monstrous/dangerous killers, literally could see all this process once buddha guided them! This is really amazing. So the difference is only being able to witness/see it and being unable to. Feels like a cheat code for those who can see.
There, rejecting the ‘mundane worldviews’ (‘āpāna‘) is to reject the idea that sensory experiences are real. Embracing the ‘Buddha’s worldview’ (‘āna‘) is to realize that any feeling of ‘sukha‘ and ‘dukha‘ in sensory experiences are triggered by the ‘distorted sanna‘.
So both pleasant as well as unpleasant experiences are due to distorted sanna? My understanding is that all the unpleasant, unagreeable, unwanted things are manifestations of distorted sanna and all that is pleasant, agreeable, wanted, was also the manifestation of distorted sanna but only for anariyas. I also believe that ariyas see the secret or reality, and they know what is suffering and what is not; they know what is really pleasant, agreeable, wanted as compared to what puthujjana/anariya understand by pleasant, agreeable, wanted. They are not same.
So aanapanasati involves various levels and it is not just about discarding harmful and embracing beneficial things. Or it is maybe just deeper meaning of itself.
The best example of that is ‘rupa sanna‘ or the ‘distorted sight’. We see colorful objects, but no such objects exist in the world! In fact, even our ability to ‘see anything’ is generated via that ‘rupa sanna‘. See “Human Life is Unlivable in a ‘Colorless’ World.”
So, it seems to me, that only wisdom can exist in reality, everything else just takes birth and dies, again and again.
The problem is not with ‘seeing’ but with attaching to the vedana (joyful or depressing/angry feelings) and engaging in immoral deeds. However, as long as one does not fully comprehend how those six types of ‘distorted sanna‘ (via the six senses) arise, engaging in such immoral deeds cannot be stopped with ‘willpower’.
Yes, I understand this at some level. Willpower is overhyped. There are some things, which willpower can never even touch.
I vividly remember coming accross this website in 2018-2019, I read the post on the real meaning of anicca, dukkha, anatta multiple times but can’t quite understand it, until I try my favorite way to learn a new concept: pretend we are teaching someone.
Hello friend. That’s interesting way. Btw there are many other forums or websites about buddha’s teachings, but based on the discussions there from the members/admins there, it always felt to me that, what they are actually telling about buddha’s teachings, always had some dilution/distortion because of that person who is discussing that teaching. I never had any ‘aha’ experience that is worth talking but I read many suttas, translations, discussions and even took part in discussions. Almost every other platform just seemed to be talking/speaking through textbook knowledge only. I always believed that there is always a difference between one who is talking about buddha’s teaching (or any part of it) through textbook knowledge and the one who is talking about buddha’s teaching (or any part of it) through actual realization! But my experience changed once I came to this puredhamma.net website. This is just my opinion. So I am glad you found this platform.
In the ‘evolution of the eyes’ model proposed by physics/science, there is no such connection to the next life or rebirth.
That is the basis of the theory of evolution. It cannot, and it does not even try to connect to future lives. Those scientists DO NOT believe in rebirth. Their model is based on a life that ends at the death of the physical body.In my opinion, the biggest proof of (presence of) rebirth is the variations we see everywhere. If there were no rebirth, then everything would be same, without any color! I believe the differentiation in any thing starts only from past causes and variations we see everywhere, including ourselves, are just different effects of different causes. If rebirth were not there, at that point, there are no causes for any differentiation to even start to take place. Idk if I am correct here, but it makes sense to me somehow.
Eyes cannot evolve in sentient beings without there being sentient beings without eyes!
I can really see the logic behind this sentence. It is like saying the tree comes to existence out of nowhere, without believing or knowing anything about seed. In my opinion, the eyes or any other organ, is grown because of causes. Something is there which cannot survive without them and craves something, which requires the eyes or any other sense organ as means.
The rebirth process is sustained by accumulated kammic energies, i.e., via immoral or unwise deeds, speech, and thoughts.
ven. Lal sir, here, can we say that rebirth process is also sustained by accumulated kammic energies, via also the moral or wise deeds, speech and thoughts??
One day, scientists and philosophers who embrace uccheda ditthi (life ends with the death of the physical body because thoughts arise in the brain) will have no choice but to abandon that assumption.
Sir, I used to also think that thoughts could not be arising in brain, but when I read your posts, it just gave me final proofs. I have one thing to add here. In my case at least, when I close my eyes and try to just witness or look inside, it doesn’t at all feels like I am sitting inside my head! Rather it seems I am either present somewhere hidden inside or all over inside, but in any case not inside the head/brain! Because I believe almost everyone has internal monologue, it is like validating one’s own existence continuously, subconsciously and automatically. I believe any one can do this experiment, if one tries to witness by closing eyes, one can see many proofs that thoughts do not arise in brain, brain just receives them and puts on the stage. I see it like, seeing something happen on laptop’s screen gives impression that everything is happening on the screen, but in reality, everything is happening in the cpu, gpu, ram, etc, and screen is just showing the output/result/effect. So brain is like screen and ram, cpu, gpu represent mind. This is not perfect analogy, but it came to my mind.
Ven. Lal sir, I read the latest post titled, “Is It Necessary for a Sotāpanna to Abstain from Sensual Pleasures?”, I felt piti while reading it. I did not understand it 100% but I understood what I understand and what I don’t, 100%. I want to comment on few quotes from that post, and possibly ask questions.
This quote: “It Is a Waste of Time for a Puthujjana to Try to Cultivate Satipaṭṭhāna
3. Many people waste their time trying to engage in Satipaṭṭhāna and Satta Bojjhaṅga (i.e., cultivate the Noble Eightfold Path) while still a puthujjana.”
and this quote about‘Ekayano Maggo‘ Mentioned in the Satipaṭṭhāna Sutta: “Nowadays, puthujjanās believe they can engage in Vipassanā. For example, ‘Vipassanā sessions’ are conducted in most ‘meditation programs’ attended by puthujjanās.”
and this quote: “That refers only to a Sotāpanna and not to a puthujjana!”I know such people, and they are very close to me. They are like trying to cut the strongest rope ever, using bluntest blade ever! I believe doing that is directly trying to realize ‘dukkha’, without understanding ‘anicca’. You will experience dukkha, but you won’t understand it is dukkha properly, so you will suffer until you realize anicca.
Having said that, this part: “The first step is to understand that sensual pleasures are devoid of value and excessive attachment to them leads to much suffering; this is also called understanding ‘yoniso manasikāra’ (or realizing our attachments are rooted in the perception that sensory experiences are real)”; I can relate to this part actually. I don’t exactly understand that they are unreal, but I confidently know that, whatever they are, that is not something happening outside, rather it is all happening inside mind. Outside is just projected reality because of internal causes. If I could stretch it, our entire personality as well as our conceived outside world, is also a internal projection at some level.
This quote: “If one sees any colors, including white light, that confirms it is definitely not an Ariya jhāna.”. I have actually experienced this more than once few years back, and I know it is just some phenomena, that really makes one believe that one is experiencing something extraordinary and of worth. In reality it is just distraction.
So, if there is a person, who believes he is doing vipassana (while trying to practice it daily, just as you mentioned about puthujjanas trying to practice vipassana) while not at all understanding yoniso manasikāra and on top of that, having wrong view of Uccheda Diṭṭhi at a confident level, does such a person, if he continues what he is doing, have any hope of doing any progress, even if it is very slow?
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Usually, the gati of the parents (especially the mother) must match that of the gandhabba (manomaya kaya) entering the womb.
Hello Ven. Lal sir. Can you please tell me why the mother’s gati is especially more important? Does that mean it depends on the mother what kind of child is being conceived, in terms of jati sotapanna, ariya, or just puthujjana? And what role does the father’s gati play?
I always believed that mother’s gati plays more important role in what kind of gandhabba or manomaya kaya is entering the womb, but I never understood how and why.1 user thanked author for this post.
Mara Devaputta is the leader of the highest Deva realm. Some say he can affect others’ minds. But I am not certain that he can affect the mind of a Sotapanna.
Even humans can affect other humans’ minds. Not with telepathic powers, but just by talking to them. That can go both ways. For example, one always learns the Buddha’s teachings from another person.Yes it makes sense, really. I got my answers. Thank you sir.
Of course, anyone with even the slightest faith in the Buddha would have asked the Buddha to stay alive as long as possible. The maximum lifespan at that time was around 100-120 years.
This actually answered my question.
Venerable Ananda was a Sotapanna, so if he understood the question, he would definitely have asked the Buddha to stay alive as long as possible.
Yes I also believe that he simply did not understand the hint and that’s why later regretted so much. He had 3 chances and he didn’t say a word for even 3rd time, so he just did not understand that, at that time.
Some say that Ven. Ananda’s mind was influenced by the Mara Devaputta. But I don’t want to speculate.
I forgot to mention this Mara Devaputta thing in my last message. Just a related question, is Mara Devaputta capable of doing such thing? I have always understood that when one is emotionally intense/wrong and takes decisions out of attachments and avijja, in such case one is always under the influence of Mara Devaputta. Am I correct here?
This issue does not affect our efforts to attain Nibbana. It is better to focus on issues that are relevant to that goal.
Yes sir. I understand this. I just don’t want to leave any regrets before reaching final goal. That is why I am asking these not-much-beneficial questions. I request you to answer above remaining questions, then I will stop. Your responses actually answer my questions and also other questions that I had but not asked.
