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Yes. You bring up an excellent point.
1. Most people just know the steps in PS. They have no idea what each step means. One can write a book on each step, especially for the “tanha paccaya upadana” step. That is where we get attached to an arammana and start accumulating kamma.
- This is when we start generating abhisankhara with “avijja paccaya sankhara” and initiate numerous PS cycles going round and round.
- This sutta explains that step in a bit more detail.
- I have discussed that in “Taṇhā Paccayā Upādāna – Critical Step in Paṭicca Samuppāda” and “Difference Between Tanhā and Upādāna.” I may have used different terms, but the idea is the same.
- Another relevant point is the importance of vaci sankhara, which is two-fold: (i) we first start thinking how to respond to an arammana, (ii) if our feelings get energized, we will start talking about it/asking about it, etc.
2. The following verses, starting with the verse you quoted, explain that:
“9.1Iti kho panetaṁ, ānanda, vedanaṁ paṭicca taṇhā, taṇhaṁ paṭicca pariyesanā, pariyesanaṁ paṭicca lābho, lābhaṁ paṭicca vinicchayo, vinicchayaṁ paṭicca chandarāgo, chandarāgaṁ paṭicca ajjhosānaṁ, ajjhosānaṁ paṭicca pariggaho, pariggahaṁ paṭicca macchariyaṁ, macchariyaṁ paṭicca ārakkho. 9.2Ārakkhādhikaraṇaṁ daṇḍādānasatthādānakalahaviggahavivādatuvaṁtuvaṁpesuññamusāvādā aneke pāpakā akusalā dhammā sambhavanti.
10.1‘Ārakkhādhikaraṇaṁ daṇḍādānasatthādānakalahaviggahavivādatuvaṁtuvaṁpesuññamusāvādā aneke pāpakā akusalā dhammā sambhavantī’ti iti kho panetaṁ vuttaṁ, tadānanda, imināpetaṁ pariyāyena veditabbaṁ, yathā ārakkhādhikaraṇaṁ daṇḍādānasatthādānakalahaviggahavivādatuvaṁtuvaṁpesuññamusāvādā aneke pāpakā akusalā dhammā sambhavanti. 10.2Ārakkho ca hi, ānanda, nābhavissa sabbena sabbaṁ sabbathā sabbaṁ kassaci kimhici, sabbaso ārakkhe asati ārakkhanirodhā api nu kho daṇḍādānasatthādānakalahaviggahavivādatuvaṁtuvaṁpesuññamusāvādā aneke pāpakā akusalā dhammā sambhaveyyun”ti?
3. The English translation there gives some idea. But those verses need to be explained in one’s own words.
“ajjhosānaṁ” means “really getting trapped in that arammana,” thinking, “should I do this or that? How can I get this for myself without others grabbing it?” , etc.
- This is also represented by vitakka/vicara. See “Vitakka, Vicāra, Savitakka, Savicāra, and Avitakka, Avicāra.”
Feel free to ask further questions after reading those posts.
The second reference is better, and gives the basic idea:
“Lokoti—khandhaloko, dhātuloko, āyatanaloko, vipattibhavaloko, vipattisambhavaloko, sampattibhavaloko, sampattisambhavaloko.”
It identifies several ways the Buddha characterized “the world of 31 realms.”
khandhaloko – five aggregates
dhātuloko – six dhātus (pathavi, āpo, tejo, vāyo, ākasa, vinnāna)
āyatanaloko – 12 āyatana (six internal, six external)
P.S. (one hour later) I revised the following:
vipattibhavaloko – the four lowest realms (apāya) arising due to bad kamma vipāka (vipatti)
vipattisambhavaloko – realms where apāyagāmi deeds are done (mostly the human realm)
sampattibhavaloko – the higher 27 realms (sugati) arising due to good kamma vipāka (sampatti)
sampattisambhavaloko –realms where sugatigāmi deeds are done (mostly the human realm)
Thank you for taking the time to use the correct formatting. It helps me and also others to point the link to
the verse in question.
- It is easy to do: The following is the link with markers (with Pali and English side-by-side) for SN 22.21:
- “Ānanda Sutta (SN 22.21)“
- Once you find the sutta number (say, MN 1), replace “sn22.21” in that link with “mn1,” and you will get the sutta reference for MN 1.
- Make sure to use lowercase and no gap in between (sn22.5, mn1, etc.).
- Then click on the marker you need to point to (suppose we want to show verse 1.14) in the above link. Then you will get the correct link: “Ānanda Sutta (SN 22.21)“
- Please keep the above link saved as a bookmark so you can use it in the future.
P.S. I see that the formatting option to “open the link in a new tab” is not there. I will see if I can fix that.
Yes. Thank you! I have revised it as follows:
“For example, the concept of anicca is understood gradually—from the Sotapanna Anugāmi stage to the Sotāpanna stage. A Sotapanna fully comprehends the anicca nature and the anatta nature. The next step is to comprehend dukkha and asubha nature fully. See, “Vipallāsa (Diṭṭhi, Saññā, Citta) Affect Saṅkhāra.”
Another related video is below. Is there a coverup? There is a Buddha statue too!
1 user thanked author for this post.
Jorg asked: “However, why use this specific term vikkhepa?”
Why not? Vikkhepa DOES mean “confusion.”Jorg: “Another reason is that one might still interpret anapanassati as mindfulness of breathing if one takes vikkhepa as “distracted,” so I was looking for some details from that perspective as well.”
– One is distracted if confused.
– The main problem is that people are trying very hard to justify their addiction to “breath meditation.” Once, a moderator at Dhamma Wheel became upset with me. He wrote something like, “I have practiced breath meditation for 30 years. How can you tell me it does not work?”
– It is possible to be on the wrong path for billions of years, not just a mere 30 years! Until one learns the Ānāpānasati taught by a Buddha, one will never be able to know what it is and practice it.
– Of course, one can get “peace of mind” by practicing breath meditation or other mundane kasina meditations. That can lead to anariya jhana and even abhinna powers if one stays away from sensual pleasures. Devadatta did precisely that and attained abhinna powers. But he ended up in an apaya.Please read the post, “Ānāpānasati – Overview” carefully and let me know if there is ANY wiggle room to justify Ānāpānasati as “breath meditation.”
– I just revised that post a bit more.
– I would be happy to discuss that post with anyone anywhere. That is the only way to settle this issue once and for all.Achieving “big things” depends on one’s state of mind.
– The state of mind of a Noble Person is different from that of an average human.
– “Big things” for an average person is to achieve “worldly things” like wealth and physical beauty.
– But “big things” for an Ariya are the stages of magga phala.For example, ‘Alexander the Great” is hailed a hero among average humans. He won many battles and conquered many countries.
But he attained nothing of value in the end because he died without making any spiritual progress. Because of the countless lives he destroyed, he is probably born in a lower realm.
– On the other hand, our Bodhisatta gave up his princely life and attained Buddhahood.However, one should not go to extremes either in interpreting the above.
– For example, one must take care of one’s physical body by exercising regularly and eating well. That helps avoid getting sick and also maintains a healthy brain. Those are important to be able to follow the Noble Path and get to magga phala.1 user thanked author for this post.
“Before the mentioning of “junior mendicants realized a higher distinction than they had before. Did these “junior mendicants” also include non-ariya’s ?”
All the bhikkhus there were at or above the Sotapanna stage.
– I have revised your link to show “tabs” or “markers” and the sutta opens at your first verse.
– At marker 8.1 the Buddha specifically states that the assembly of bhikkhus are all Ariyas. (Translated there as “it’s free of nonsense.”)
– Starting at marker 9.1, the Buddha states that even more specifically. Some are Arahants (at 9.1); some are Anagamis (at 10.1) and so on.I think that answers your second question as well.
Ānāpānasati can lead to Arahanthood (Nibbana) only if the practitioner has understood that remaining in the rebirth process is dangerous. Then one must CULTIVATE the Nobel Path that one has “SEEN” to get to Arahanthood.
– One SEES the Path with Lokuttara Samma Ditthi at the Sotapanna stage. Then one can follow that path by the practice of Ānāpānasati.
– P.P.S. At the marker 28.1, the Buddha stated that fulfilling Ānāpānasati will fulfil the four stages of Satipaṭṭhāna: “Ānāpānassati Sutta”However, non-Ariya can do the “mundane version” of Ānāpānasati, and complete the mundane path so that they can comprehend the Noble Truths/PS/Tilakkhana.
P.S. The “mundane version” of Ānāpānasati includes, of course, the following: Taking in good morals and cultivating “good gati“, discarding bad gati, learning (taking in) correct teachings of the Buddha, discarding wrong views by contemplating those teachings and related material (like rebirth accounts, Out-Of-Body experiences, Near- Death Experiences), etc.
I am afraid I cannot help. If I can find a contact for Abhaya Thero, I will email you at the address I have for you (forum registration.)
Some cases like this could be “not real” in the sense it is “made up” by the person’s mind, even though the person may truly believe it to be true.
– Of course, I don’t know enough to say about your mother’s situation. I am not an expert on these issues.“what I meant by the black magic person is the one who is sending the preta.”
I think you may have the wrong picture.
– But let me get the facts straight first. Are there two persons/beings involved in “possessing” your mother?1. One is your mother’s sister’s husband, and the other is a “preta”?
2. Is your mother’s sister’s husband still alive? If so, does he have the power to send a “preta” to your mother? How?I reread the thread to get an idea of the problem. The following are my observations.
1. Your suspicions about the “black magic person” may be correct. I have heard of such instances in Sri Lanka. Abhaya Thero could be helpful if you could contact him. I will see if any of my contacts know how to contact him. He used to investigate such cases in Sri Lanka before becoming a bhikkhu. The following is one of his several videos on youtube.
2. Normally, such a “black magic person” can be attracted to a particular person, a place that he/she liked, or a combination of such factors. They cannot exert influence on people with strong willpower. It is possible that either she is the only “target” or the one with the least willpower among you.
– Does she practice Buddha Dhamma? If one is fully engaged in following Buddha Dhamma, it is less likely that such “black magic persons” can influence that person. Just reciting suttas is not enough. But combining those two will have a stronger effect.
– If you or an exorcist can talk to the “black magic person,” you can ask what it wants. Sometimes their wish can be fulfilled by making an offering to Bhikkhus, as I have seen in some videos by Abhaya Thero. In those videos (as in the above video), Abhaya Thero talked to the “black magic person” through the patient (i.e., your mother in this case.) When the patient is “possessed” by the “black magic person,” the words are that of the “black magic person.”
– By the way, to “take possession” of a patient’s body, either the patient must be willing, or the patient does not have enough willpower to resist.3. Moving to a new house may or may not help. Since the “black magic person” came to the relative’s wedding, she seems to be followed, and the attraction is mostly to her, not the house. But I am not sure. It may help.
I have revised your link to point to that verse.
– English translation there is not bad, but I would write as: “That’s how I instruct Bhikkhus who are trainees—who haven’t achieved Arahanthood, but live aspiring to attain Nibbana.”
– That translator translates “bhikkhu” as “mendicant” all the time. A Bhikkhu is NOT a “begger”: “mendicant definition”
– It is an insult to call a Bhikkhu a “begger”!Anyway, the point is that “sekkhā” is a “trainee,” someone on the Noble Path who has not attained Arahanthood.
– “apattamānasā” means “not reached.”
– “anuttaraṁ yogakkhemaṁ” means “ultimate goal”
– “patthayamānā viharanti” means “live aspiring to reach that goal.”Also, when posting at the forum, please take a moment to format it. I have revised the title as well. It will look better and will save time for others (especially by making the link to appear in a different tab; that is in #2 of the instructions: “Note: Don’t forget to check the little box “Open link in a new tab” so that when someone clicks on the link, it will be opened in a new window.”)
– Instructions: “How to Post/Reply to a Forum Question“TGS wrote: “My answer to my question #1. is that there are no 1st, 2nd, 3rd jhana samapatti. If there are no jhana samapatti from 1st to 3rd jhana, than my question #2. is invalid. How did I arrive to such conclusions?
This is something I’m not totally sure about, but thought to bring it up for scrutiny and advice….”
There is a samapatti corresponding to any given jhana.
– I have given the definition of a samapatti. It is when jhanic citta vithi runs continuously without “falling back” to kamavacara citta vithi. One is fully absorbed in the jhana. That is the definition of jhana samapatti.That also applies to a phala samapatti. The phala citta runs continuously without falling back. Mind is fully absorbed there without falling back to be aware of the external world.
I have entirely rewritten an old post, “Power of the Human Mind – Anariya or Mundane Jhānas” that will hopefully address the questions raised by TGS.
It is only a draft, and I hope to refine it.
Feel free to point out any mistakes/omissions or ask unresolved questions so I can improve the post.I went through other older posts on jhana, samapatti, etc., and some need to be rewritten or revised.
Thanks, Tobias.
Yes. That was an error. I have revised that sentence in #8 as follows:
“But there are Paññāvimutta Arahants who had not cultivated jhāna but attained Arahanthood in relatively short times. However, they also get to the vicinity of the first jhāna briefly at the moment of Arahant magga phala, but they need to practice jhāna to get into jhāna at will.”“Samādhi, Jhāna, and Sammā Samādhi”
Only Upacāra (U), Anuloma (A) samadhi are needed to get to any magga phala. See #14 and #15 of the following post for citta vithi involving magga phala and jhana.
“Citta Vīthi – Processing of Sense Inputs“Yes. Nibbana can be reached in many ways. There are many suttas stating that in different ways.
1. “Dutiyaānanda Sutta (SN 54.14)“: “Ānāpānassatisamādhi, ānanda, ekadhammo bhāvito bahulīkato cattāro satipaṭṭhāne paripūreti, cattāro satipaṭṭhānā bhāvitā bahulīkatā satta bojjhaṅge paripūrenti, satta bojjhaṅgā bhāvitā bahulīkatā vijjāvimuttiṁ paripūrentīti.”
That means “Ānāpānassati samādhi, when developed and cultivated, fulfills satipaṭṭhāna. And when satipaṭṭhāna developed and cultivated, fulfill the seven awakening factors (satta bojjhaṅga). And the seven awakening factors, when developed and cultivated, fulfill knowledge and freedom (vijjāvimuttiṁ paripūrentīti), i.e., Arahanthood.2. “Avijjā Sutta (AN 10.61)” at the end: “Evamevaṁ kho, bhikkhave, sappurisasaṁsevo paripūro saddhammassavanaṁ paripūreti, saddhammassavanaṁ paripūraṁ saddhaṁ paripūreti, saddhā paripūrā yonisomanasikāraṁ paripūreti, yonisomanasikāro paripūro satisampajaññaṁ paripūreti, satisampajaññaṁ paripūraṁ indriyasaṁvaraṁ paripūreti, indriyasaṁvaro paripūro tīṇi sucaritāni paripūreti, tīṇi sucaritāni paripūrāni cattāro satipaṭṭhāne paripūrenti, cattāro satipaṭṭhānā paripūrā satta bojjhaṅge paripūrenti, satta bojjhaṅgā paripūrā vijjāvimuttiṁ paripūrenti; 9.2evametissā vijjāvimuttiyā āhāro hoti, evañca pāripūrī”ti.”
3. The following sutta starts even earlier with “associating with good people/Noble Persons.” “Taṇhā Sutta (AN 10.62)“: “Iti kho, bhikkhave, sappurisasaṁsevo paripūro saddhammassavanaṁ paripūreti, saddhammassavanaṁ paripūraṁ saddhaṁ paripūreti, saddhā paripūrā yonisomanasikāraṁ paripūreti, yonisomanasikāro paripūro satisampajaññaṁ paripūreti, satisampajaññaṁ paripūraṁ indriyasaṁvaraṁ paripūreti, indriyasaṁvaro paripūro tīṇi sucaritāni paripūreti, tīṇi sucaritāni paripūrāni cattāro satipaṭṭhāne paripūrenti, cattāro satipaṭṭhānā paripūrā satta bojjhaṅge paripūrenti, satta bojjhaṅgā paripūrā vijjāvimuttiṁ paripūrenti;”
– Here, if one learns the correct Dhamma, one can fulfill all requirements step by step.4. The following sutta points out that by following any parts of the 37 factors of Enlightenment (Catunnaṁ satipaṭṭhānānaṁ, catunnaṁ sammappadhānānaṁ, catunnaṁ iddhipādānaṁ, pañcannaṁ indriyānaṁ, pañcannaṁ balānaṁ, sattannaṁ bojjhaṅgānaṁ, ariyassa aṭṭhaṅgikassa maggassa) one can get to Nibbana. “Bhāvanā Sutta (AN 7. 71)”
– “catunnaṁ sammappadhānānaṁ” = four supreme efforts that you mentioned!
