DN 2, Anyone can answer.

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    • #32613
      Sotapanna anugami
      Participant

      In starting of DN suttas Buddha’s teaching goes like this:
      DN.2
      -Moral Discipline
      -Restraint from sense faculties
      -Mindfulness and Clear comprehension
      -Contentment
      Abandoning of the Hindrances
      Then 1 to 4 Jhanas
      -Insight knowledge
      -The knowledge of Mind-made body
      -The knowledge of the modes of Supernormal Power…..
      ……To The knowledge of divine eye
      Knowledge of destruction of Cankers
      Then, in last he states “Destroyed the birth, the holy life has been lived, what had to be done has been done, there is nothing beyond this.”

      My Doubt:
      -I think in last, Buddha is referring to Arahanthood, but isn’t Uddhacca removed only at arahant stage? So does Abandoning the hindrances mean removing them completely then getting into Jhanas OR removing them by contemplating them in the next 4 Jhanas? So that means one has to get into Jhanas either way?

    • #32615
      Lal
      Keymaster

      “Buddha is referring to Arahanthood, but isn’t Uddhacca removed only at arahant stage?”

      Yes. That is right.

      “So does Abandoning the hindrances mean removing them completely then getting into Jhanas OR removing them by contemplating them in the next 4 Jhanas? ”

      – Here is a key point to understand. There is a HUGE difference between mundane (anariya) jhanas and Ariya jhanas.
      – Anariya jhanas attained via anariya techniques like breath meditation. Hidden defilements (anusaya) for raga, dosa, moha NOT removed by those techniques. Those defilements are merely SUPPRESSED.
      – One gets to Ariya jhanas by removing layers of anusaya (at different levels) in successive jhanas. At the fourth jhana, one has removed even the avijja anusaya completely.
      One must be at least an Anagami to GET TO the fourth jhana.
      – One can attain the Arahant stage by cultivating the fourth jhana and then cultivating higher arupavacara jhanas, and then eventually getting to the highest arupavacara jhana and getting to nirodha samapatti. This is one way (step-by-step) to attain Arahanthod (cetovimutti)
      – One can get to Arahanthood also via vipassana (insight meditation) from any of the Ariya or anariya jhana (or even with upacara samadhi, which is just below the first jhana). That is the other way of pannavimutti.

      Each of us (and even any animal) had cultivated all anariya jhanas in our deep past.
      – That is why getting attached to jhanic pleasures is NOT a good idea.

      An Ariya (a Noble Person) automatically GETS Ariya jhanas when he/she cultivates the Path.
      – One SHOULD NOT cultivate jhanas with the expectation of experiencing “jhanic pleasures.”
      – An Ariya ALWAYS takes Nibbana (discarding worldly things) as the arammana or the main goal.
      – If one takes a worldly object (such as breath or a kasina object) as the arammana, that WILL lead to an anariya jhana.

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